Ride etiquette

Having spent yesterday morning looking at my speedo reading 45k on the flat I thought 'this is ridiculous, I'd have to do 50k in the wind if i was shelled out the back' (I got shelled with 20k to go so limped home alone) I read this with interest.

I cannot emphasise enough the benefit of keeping together and the importance of finding a group speed. However if an individual is obviously suffering at what everyone else considers a relaxed pace... what to do?
Drop them. Drop them hard.

When they arrive at the cafe at the end of the day, broken and in tears - Jeer at them. Jeer, boo, and throw macchiato.

what a great thread, actually was smiling as i was reading through this!

What to do when someone on your club ride thinks it appropriate to blast music from a speaker in their bag for the entirety of the ride, and the duration of the coffee break. WAC.

every time the leaders rotate, it becomes 4 abreast for the duration of the changeover, it's not mentioned but would seem to take some skill and judgement to know when is the right time, and what to do if other vehicles/road conditions become less than ideal mid-change.

Rotating paceline is better ideal than this.

See

http://www.lostrivercycling.org/paceline.html

What to do when someone on your club ride thinks it appropriate to blast music from a speaker in their bag for the entirety of the ride, and the duration of the coffee break. WAC.

Find a new club?

Skydancer how would you feel about adding something about not going off the front ahead of the leader when you don't actually know the way?

I hate to sound like a grump, but I find the single most frustrating thing when you're leading a ride (and have a mixed ability group) is the faster people from within the group going off ahead, even though they don't know the way, when you as the ride leader could easily go off ahead but you're not because you're thinking about people at the back and not dropping them.

What then happens is:

• The group gets split up
  
• Those who have gone ahead get to junction
  
• At which point they either wait (the sensible option) or take a wrong turn (the non-sensible option). Unfortunately the non-sensible option actually happens fairly often
  
• I get annoyed.
  
  
  

Maybe the onus is on me to do more of 1? Although I have found that even when I explain the problem with doing it mid-ride people still do it :/

Tell them at the start not to, and if riders then go off the front let them.
I usually take the next junction whether I was planning to or not. They are then not part of the ride and not your problem, if they come back the next week they will not make the same mistake again.

Yeah, I end up getting to the point where I just carry on with the ride and if they have to catch up they have to catch up. My patience on this one wears pretty quickly.

Definitely seems worth adding to the list.

Isn't this list for ride leaders not riders?
So a bit usless to add something for people coming on ride.

Tell them at the start not to, and if riders then go off the front let them.

This, especially letting them head off the wrong way without waiting for them.

Isn't this list for ride leaders not riders?
So a bit usless to add something for people coming on ride.

Useful to know of what possible scenario a riders might do and how to deal with it.

Isn't this list for ride leaders not riders?
So a bit usless to add something for people coming on ride.

Yeah, that's why I'm asking for a solution to avoid something happening (as a ride leader) :P

you may want to add something about not obscuring hazardous objects from view for trailing riders after the HHSB to Cambridge incident.

Yeah, that's why I'm asking for a solution to avoid something happening (as a ride leader) :P

Fair enough. I find this thread a bit prescriptive. Rides should be led totally different way depending on number, ability and conditions and length.
Anyone who is leading a ride should be competent enough to make decisions without completing a checklist.

I'm still waiting for skydancer to lead a rider leaders ride ride, and show us how it's done with his wealth of experience :p

@Fox - assuming people have been told about follow-the-leader protocol before the ride, then:

• let people go up the road, and that’s fine if they wait in a sensible position once they don’t know where to go (they rarely do, choosing instead to wobble all over the lane looking over their shoulders and generally being hazardous)… unless the ride leader deems it’s having a negative effect on managing the group, in which case they’ll have to tow the line*
  
  

or

• bitch at them constantly for half-wheeling and show-boating, even if they’re not actually doing it (the Buffalo Bill method)
  
  

or

• just fucking drop them, after telling them they can lead the rest of the ride if they’re that desperate to be at the front; either choosing a moment in the route that suits your strengths so you can definitively make them crack, or using your knowledge of the area in order to casually drift to the back of the group and then turn off at some unscheduled point, never to be seen again.
  
  

There are 2 types of considerate rider it’s nice to experience:

i) they quietly approach you before the ride and state they have some personal agenda that involves the odd moment of exertion off the front, but they’ll make sure it doesn’t interfere with the ride as a whole

ii) they quickly realise that they’ve completely misjudged the ride (being either too strong and with an unbending idea of what they want to do, or not strong enough and inexorably bound to drag the rest of the group into a grumpy stupor or dangerous mess) and they politely make their excuses and bail within a few miles or whatever is still a comfortable location from which to find their own way home / carry on solo

Not sure whether to deal you the 2nd nerg I've ever issued in my lerfghers career for "tow the line" or not. On the one hand, I don't like to nerg people. On the other, you definitely deserve it.

Your narrow semantic-pragmatic horizon displeases me.

BUMMF in spelling shocker.

Well now, I would have expected more. But now he has shown his true colors.

Fuck of.

I think he protests to much.

You’re mum.

There's no need for insult's

No, you're *a *mum! congratulation!

Skydancer how would you feel about adding something about not going off the front ahead of the leader when you don't actually know the way?

I think that such discussions and ride ground rules should happen at the start (point 1 and 5). If a rider chooses to ride ahead without knowing the way and wobble while waiting for the rest to catch up then ask them either to stay with the group if the plan is to keep together.If they keep this up and it genuinely disturbs people or increases risk, explain why you prefer them to stay with the group or suggest that the ride isn't for them.

Don't know of this needs a separate point on the list, just some people management skills by the leader.

Fair enough. I find this thread a bit prescriptive. Rides should be led totally different way depending on number, ability and conditions and length.
Anyone who is leading a ride should be competent enough to make decisions without completing a checklist.

I'm still waiting for skydancer to lead a rider leaders ride ride, and show us how it's done with his wealth of experience :p

These are guidelines and suggestions rather than proscriptions Laner. Any good ride leader should be flexible about how things flow and set up expectations with participants as to how rides run.

I will set a date for a ride leader ride though the last date wasn't very popular. Perhaps we can organise this together Laner?

So I think skydancer just told me I've got crap people management skills! Quite possibly true...

It probably doesn't merit a point on the list, but I just wanted to raise it somewhere to see if I was missing something and here felt like the right place.

@Laner I agree but a lot of the points on skydancer's list are true of all rides. Forum rides these days can have quite a broad range of abilities, which I find makes leading a ride more challenging.

let people go up the road, and that’s fine if they wait in a sensible position once they don’t know where to go (they rarely do, choosing instead to wobble all over the lane looking over their shoulders and generally being hazardous)

Yeah, I don't have a problem with people going ahead in principle. More the taking the wrong turning and splitting off half the group bit.

bitch at them constantly for half-wheeling and show-boating, even if they’re not actually doing it (the Buffalo Bill method)

Hah. I did an audax once with Bill and he did indeed repeatedly tell me off for half-wheeling, even though I felt I wasn't...

just fucking drop them, after telling them they can lead the rest of the ride if they’re that desperate to be at the front; either choosing a moment in the route that suits your strengths so you can definitively make them crack, or using your knowledge of the area in order to casually drift to the back of the group and then turn off at some unscheduled point, never to be seen again.

lol. I should point out my rides do generally get positive feedback, I'm not sure how I'd do this without also dropping the rear half. I don't intend to bolster my feedback by pulling slower riders along with a rope though :)

I'd be up for ride leader training if the date works David.

I have some rides/routes I do semi often by myself not entirely commuting as I "go the long way" with a shop or something as an unimportant destination. Would it be good/bad to add a start/end meeting point and open it upto others?

One for example would be streatham hill/brixton hill out to tooting bec, around/across balham, around some of the paths inside clapham common, stop at asda clapham junction to grab some stuff and then back to streatham hill/brixton hill on another non direct route to bring it upto 15 or so miles.

With the better weather I ended up in Richmond one night just going "oooo never been down that road" so hopefully by the end of the summer I'm doing crazy miles.

I think whip skidding in the middle of the road in front of people should be added to this list.