Tourney: EHBPC 2012 - Paris - 2012/07/19-21

I don't really understand why fore-arms are permitted contact, and elbows aren't. But I like that they have written a lot more rules banning pushing, hooking, punching etc, as these were all missing from the original NAH draft.

I'd say an elbow is still more dangerous than a forearm. A forearm might take you down, but I doubt the contact itself would do serious damage. An elbow in the right place could break some ribs.

I'm gonna send the below to Greg for consideration, any other thoughts?

6.2 Back wheels should be on the board and not on the goal line.
6.11 "Referee's discretion if the other team aren't ready" is rubbish and clearly isn't a rule, re-write (as a rule) or remove, this is where the cheap shot rule should be (shooting before a player or the ball has crossed the line).
7.1 Need to define small circular end (or similar), badly written.
7.3.1 Badly written (all own goal shuffles should be goals unless they are deflections from attacking shuffles).
7.4.1 Badly written
8.6 I'd change this to "severely injured", too many players ham up grazes/bruises and get the game stropped by inexperienced refs.
9.1 This is not a rule and is ambiguous at best (one person's reckless is another person's safe).
10.1.1 Forearms is going to open up a whole new grey area that hasn't been addressed, it will be "interesting" to see how Euro teams interpret this rule.
10.1.4 "Cheap shots" are currently known as shots from your own half before the game has restarted, so this is pretty confusing in my opinion. Also, the use of "excessive" is slightly subjective and should be avoided.
10.2.4 No idea what this is trying to avoid?
10.9 The use of the phrase "intent" should always be avoided.
12.1.1 The escalated warnings thing is very old school in my opinion (refs now restore advantage as appropriate on the first offense and shouldn't be expected to track warnings/escalating behavior for each player)

Missing elements:
Egg and spooning seems to be permitted currently (lame)?
Radball wheel shots will be permitted?
Powerplays aren't written down (if you score the player comes back on court, etc).
Killing the ball with three bikes covering it in the corner of the court is currently permitted?
Verbal backchat to the ref is permitted?
Toppling is permitted?
High sticking is permitted?
Handlebar and steering arm infractions are permitted?
There is no allowance for the ref to start a game after a reset if the team in possession are taking too long (team talks, etc).
Jousting rules are missing (no left on right, or similar)?

Are you sending these as your personal thoughts, Jono?

Can you add a question about the term throwing to that list. I assume it's a bad translation from French, but in English seems to suggest you can pick up the ball and throw it.

12.4.2. Ball-jointing / side-jointing in the offensive zone. Scooping the ball, throwing the ball is permitted.

I'm gonna send the below to Greg for consideration, any other thoughts?

6.2 Back wheels should be on the board and not on the goal line.

I don't really care, but I think goal line is actually better, if only for the reason some bikes are longer than other, and the front of the bike being the same distance from the centre would seem fairer than the back.

But it would require an actual goal line, which I assume won't be there, in which case back is better.

10.1.4 "Cheap shots" are currently known as shots from your own half before the game has restarted, so this is pretty confusing in my opinion.

Only by us I think, don't the Americans use it for that (and therefore possibly non-native English speakers)? Either way, the two things should be clarified.

10.2.4 No idea what this is trying to avoid?

Agreed, I don't get the point of the rule at all. And tap-out is such an outdated penalty.

10.9 The use of the phrase "intent" should always be avoided.

Agreed, either you injure them, or you don't.

12.1.1 The escalated warnings thing is very old school in my opinion (refs now restore advantage as appropriate on the first offense and shouldn't be expected to track warnings/escalating behavior for each player)

Agreed, this is such a step back in time.

Missing elements:
Egg and spooning seems to be permitted currently (lame)?
Radball wheel shots will be permitted?
Powerplays aren't written down (if you score the player comes back on court, etc).
Killing the ball with three bikes covering it in the corner of the court is currently permitted?
Verbal backchat to the ref is permitted?
Toppling is permitted?
High sticking is permitted?
Handlebar and steering arm infractions are permitted?
There is no allowance for the ref to start a game after a reset if the team in possession are taking too long (team talks, etc).
Jousting rules are missing (no left on right, or similar)?

Wow, you've pointed out a lot of problems with this ruleset.

Good work Jono.

I am surprised not to see a rule declaring that anthems by The Boss are to be played after every goal.

Are you sending these as your personal thoughts, Jono?

Yep, I said to Greg, Hannes and Clement that I'd email any thoughts over as I think the NAH rules were heading in the right direction, they're free to ignore any comments.

If anyone thinks my comments are wrong/bad, then obviously feel free to reign me in.

I don't really care, but I think goal line is actually better, if only for the reason some bikes are longer than other, and the front of the bike being the same distance from the centre would seem fairer than the back.

It originally stated back wheels on the goal line, now says front wheels (unless I miss-read it this morning).

No, don't think they are wrong or bad, necessarily. Just wondering if you were doing it as any kind of rep or just as 'Jono'.

All I'd say is be a bit gentler with the phrase, 'Badly written', which is currently dotted around like red pen! I know what you mean though, but English is not their first language. Maybe someone could offer to submit an English translation to clear up the details and they can sign it off? Don't know who would have time or want to do that though.

I haven't had a chance to read the Euro ruleset yet but I'll pitch in if/when I do.

I am surprised not to see a rule declaring that anthems by The Boss are to be played after every goal.

Can't we just have you standing in the middle with a megaphone shouting 'Slag'? #absolutelydefinitelyjokingpleaseNO!

Pretty weak ruleset draft IMO.
After all the work towards putting up a draft with as few grey areas as possible, I'm a bit dissappointed to see such things as "the ref migh use his discretion to refuse a goal."
How are you supposed to inforce a ruleset like that?
-REF:
No goal!
-Player:
Why?
-REF:
Because I don't FEEL like it was one.

I don't mind some of the changes to it. It would be really nice to eventually come to a common draft of the ruleset that could be used worldwide. But this one seems so last minute, so "you know how to play you should already know the rules".

11.1.2. The ball goes out of play. The referee will stop time until the ball can be retrieved. The last team who touched the ball lost the ball. (Similar as Football)

conflicts with the latter part of

12.4.1. Tossing the ball out of the court – This is a delay of game penalty. The ball is given to the other team and the match resumes as if a goal had just been scored. A shot or shuffle that deflects off a mallet, wheel, goal post or other surface, the ball will simply be placed on the court at the point of exit and play will resume with no ball turnover.

I'm gonna send the below to Greg for consideration, any other thoughts?

I haven't had a chance to look at the rule-set in detail yet, but I'll go with what you have said. Also, it is really way too late for this, IMO. I'm not sure that I will be able to play these rules, never mind ref them.

Oh, there's nothing at all on low boards, i.e. you can check someone into the boards no matter what height they are. This is isn't a problem if the boards are nice & high, I guess.

(Also nothing about fences either, but hey-ho).

I
12.1.1 The escalated warnings thing is very old school in my opinion (refs now restore advantage as appropriate on the first offense and shouldn't be expected to track warnings/escalating behavior for each player)

This is inviting refs to do nothing. When is the correct time to give a warning? During play? Ref has to get offending player's attention, thus taking player's & ref's attention away from play.

Much better to turn ball over, warn the player during break of play.

I I'm not sure that I will be able to play these rules, never mind ref them.

I don't think we have much choice.

This is isn't a problem if the boards are nice & high, I guess.

Yeah, they will be (at the main event), they are the Avoriaz boards.

Also, it is really way too late for this, IMO. I'm not sure that I will be able to play these rules, never mind ref them.

I don't think we have much choice.

Yeah, obviously I'll abide by the reffing & rules, I meant that I'm not sure that I will be able to remember what the new rules are when I'm playing.

Oh, there's nothing at all on low boards, i.e. you can check someone into the boards no matter what height they are. This is isn't a problem if the boards are nice & high, I guess.

(Also nothing about fences either, but hey-ho).

Yeah, they will be (at the main event), they are the Avoriaz boards.

I was (selfishly) thinking of the wild-card, and wondering what sort of boards will be provided.

**10.3.2. **Throwing a rear wheel or skidding into another player’s bike is not permitted.

Needs to be more clear. As written, this could be interpreted as meaning that rolling back across a player's line is not permitted (which I guess is not the intention of the rule-writers), better to say using front-wheel as pivot, and throwing back-wheel whilst it is in the air is not permitted (so-called 'dolphin-slap').

**10.9. **Clear intent to injure another player or repeated dangerous and reckless behavior after receiving two warnings is not permitted and will be met with a two-minute penalty or ejection from the match.

Why wait for two incidents? If a player is clearly reckless, penalise straight away with a turn-over, and then go for a 30 sec penalty.

I was (selfishly) thinking of the wild-card, and wondering what sort of boards will be provided.

Fuck all I think.

I imagine it's going to be like:

Those continentals are going to get forearmed into the Seine.

Those continentals are going to get forearmed into the Seine.

Someone please make a t-shirt of this.

First the dodgy wild-card, now the dodgy rules. Another year that I'm not that gutted I missed out on the Euros.

What would Geneva do?

What is the exact location of this? Sorry if i missed it.

What is the exact location of this? Sorry if i missed it.

Invalides, which is the park in which the Eiffel tower is.

Fuck all I think.

I imagine it's going to be like:

Those continentals are going to get forearmed into the Seine.

Great minds think alike.

Invalides, which is the park in which the Eiffel tower is.

not exactly

https://maps.google.fr/maps?oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&channel=fflb&ie=UTF-8&q=invalides&fb=1&gl=fr&hq=invalides&cid=0,0,10424741693606937519&ei=yk_9T6XKMPCM0wWXsuylBw&ved=0CLEBEPwSMAA&oi=local_group