Functional bikes. Not Porn not Anti

I cant help but think that as the rack is seemingly more, or at least as robust as the frame itself. Would it have not been better to integrate the rack into the structure of the frame, to sort of replace the chainstays?

It is integrated into the frame.
I don't think I get what you mean actually.

eliminating some redundant stays?

Are they redundant or just adding the strength?
Wait but which bits are redundant?

Think of the rack as a third triangle off the back of the frame.
The right hand leg of the rack and the seat stay could conceivably be the same tube.

turn that around to make it the "right" leg

Nah you need that bit to stop the pannier rocking into the spokes.

Most people buy adult sized panniers though.

hahaha

I don't think I'm following either...do you mean like a longbike?

http://bikes-as-transportation.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/P1010492.jpg

Yep, same idea as the Tern I posted.
Tout Terrain doesn't fully trust the concept and still uses a smaller strut, though that may be for the wee panniers that M. throat referred to.

20140418-P1070045.jpg by Michael M Rennie, on Flickr"]
20140418-P1070045.jpg by Michael M Rennie, on Flickr[/URL]

Not sure if my bastardised Trek is fit for this thread but what say you?

http://www.englishcycles.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/English_Cycles_011_3127.jpg

This is a repost. It's still just about my perfect winter bike.

He may have been adding to the conversation about integrated racks.

I think I might be paraphrasing DFP here (sorry if I've interpreted you wrong DFP) by saying that for an integrated rack, it's somewhat* inelegant.

*if you ask me, it's horrendously inelegant.

The good news is it gets covered in bags and ridden away from you. Very far away, where there aren't many eyes.

Question for Spotter, JB, Scoble, andy etc, your functional bikes (with racks et al) what do they weigh?

trying to weight up how much heavier the AWOL is compared to say the genesis' etc

Think my badman with guards, rack and 32c paselas is around the 12kg mark.... Pretty sure sptrs genesis is closer to 15kg.

A question for functional folk, how soft can I get away with running 32c paselas on wide rims? I'm heavy, 110kg currently, so taking that into account.

My old Genesis without rack (mudguard and brooks though) is 11kg, my Oak is 12kg including rack and dynamo.

Wide rims can allow you to run a lower pressure, as well as reduced tyres squirming a lots if set the same pressure as you have now, only noticeable if the rims is really wide, like 21-22mm internal (like the ZTR).

They're perfect with 28mm which look closer to a 23mm on 23mm rims.

Any bigger it's hard to tell. I can't tell much difference with a 42mm tyres on a 17mm and 20mm internal, the width haven't changed.

^^ 80f / 100r at a guess.

This is good:
http://www.dorkypantsr.us/bike-tire-pressure-calculator.html

Will weigh the Cross Check (and L's Trucker as it's closer to your size I think) later but the last time I weighed the CC it was 15-16kg with the Soma rack and other accessories, 650gram tyres and maybe water... I don't fully remember

Since buying my CC I have made absolutely no effort to make it lighter, just more comfortable for me to ride. I'm hovering around 83kg, aiming for mid-high 70s. Would be a much better improvement to my riding.

What is your badman TM?

Question for Spotter, JB, Scoble, andy etc, your functional bikes (with racks et al) what do they weigh?

trying to weight up how much heavier the AWOL is compared to say the genesis' etc

Genesis with Tubus Tara low rider and rear tortec ultralite and brooks cambium weighs 11.2. I like the AWOL, But only the one that Prolly test rode, and the Di2 one. Not too mad on the 'normal one'. With that said - The fact that it comes kitted with racks/bags makes it good value.

Though, I'd be tempted to go for a Long Haul Trucker/Disc Trucker. #SurlyRentBoy. What is this for? Primary bike?

What is your badman TM?

It's a boardman cross something or other.