For Sale: My nagasawa

I think keirin bikes are beautiful to look at, fragile and often too small. I always had hankering for one of these.

Please feel free to correct me . . .

But if you build very specific bikes out of very specific materials, all governed by somewhat bizarre and strict guidelines, then you will no doubt after many years have mastered the art of building Kerin bikes down to a T, but as the same time probably not taken much note of advance in frame construction/material advances etc etc that goes on outside your bubble - i have no doubt that Nags are at the very top of the tree for hammering round a japenese track doing a good imitation of Rollerball, but wouldnt a humble BJ vigorelli be a much better daily ride?

All this is moot, because if Nags and NJS are your thing then nothing is going to stop you buying one, but i cant see how they are anyhting other than the best built Kerin frames, and that many other builders build equally as good frames?

Hourses for courses . . .

+1.
if they are so good why don't people ride them when competing in keirin races in the u.k? surely if they were superior to all other keirin bikes the british (and other riders) would use them?

FWIW, I think steel track frames accentuate the simplicity of a track bike and are more aesthetically pleasing. I doubt they perform better than either aluminium or carbon fibre but those performance differences only really matter at the highest elite level. For the rest of us the difference is negligible.

I like artisan framebuilders regardless of their nationality and appreciate the skill and attention to detail that they put into their products and which differentiate them from the mass market manufacturers, who are addressing a different market. Hopefully there is room for both in bicycle manufacturing.

i just like the look, the pretty colours, the distinctive geometry, the exoticness, the story, the rareness, the quality and the illusion of quality. doubt i'll ever own one though. whatever.

I like turtles

+1.
if they are so good why don't people ride them when competing in keirin races in the u.k? surely if they were superior to all other keirin bikes the british (and other riders) would use them?

there is actually one forum member who's qualified to answer that question, as he's both ridden and trained at the JKA and raced keirin internationally. although I imagine he has other things to do than post on here.

interesting picture choice...

I like turtles
and spam.

i just like the look, the pretty colours, the distinctive geometry, the exoticness, the story, the rareness, the quality and the illusion of quality. doubt i'll ever own one though. whatever.

all good reasons to own a nice looking bike if that's what floats you boat.
personally i prefer to ride them than ponder their intangible qualities but it's the idea that they are somehow the pinnacle of framebuilding and superior to all others i find hard to believe.

I know carbon and aluminium are better for the track... but steel is better for the road.

My Pinarello SLX is a work of art.

I reckon if you got Bob Jackson, Colnago and Nagasawa to build a frame to the same geometry and with the same tubeset, the only difference will be the BJ will be a load cheaper

I've got a BJ on order. I am literally popping boners with excitement. For me the magic is in specifying all the colours and stuff, it's personal, and that's what makes it special.

jesus what's happened here? this is like one of those old time threads from before the summer - funny, intelligent, informative, knowledgeable, pacey, non-flaming - if you're new on here READ THIS FUCKIN THREAD!

great stuff guys, best bike thread in ages imho.

I reckon if you got Bob Jackson, Colnago and Nagasawa to build a frame to the same geometry and with the same tubeset, the only difference will be the BJ will be a load cheaper

you are wrong.

@ Philjamas +1

Are Keirin frames really that fragile? The only broken ones I've seen have been hit by cars which would break any frame.

The tubes are rolled by master sushi makers, course they're not going to be as strong as their machined equivalents.

Are Keirin frames really that fragile? The only broken ones I've seen have been hit by cars which would break any frame.

the chose light weight over strength, but the guys who those bikes are made for put more power through the frame then you ever will, and they are steel, which is harder then you, so you don't need to worry to much about it breaking. some are prone to dents, as thin walled light weight tubing generaly is.

those massive, hulking, 5'4" powerhouses.

who would own you on or off the track.

Racist.

who would own you on or off the track.

not off, no.

i would simply need to put my hand on their head and let them flail about like the stumpy bastards they are.

now stop idolising japanese cyclists, it's really fucking sad.

I didn't think they would be that fragile especially since the punishments are pretty bad if they have a lot of failures.

Keirin builders are very highly respected by international framebuilders, Richard Sachs bought a Nagasawa a few years ago.

I have seen a few broken keirin fames most likely because they are built for velodromes and not for potholes - many are very beautiful - but the kudos comes I think from the efforts you have to get a nice one in a large enough size

NNNGGGGGGGGGGG pops