Current Projects chat and miscellany

Wheels and frameset are definite. The rest is just a rough shopping list, to fit my budget.

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^ look for second hand Sram Omniums, they can be had for £100, just £20 more than the Sram S300's cost new.

Are you looking at the Ritchey Streem Comp because it looks like an SLR for a quarter of the price? Not a mistake for which your arse will forgive you.

I'd go the extra fiver and buy a Wippermann 1R8 in place of the SRAM chain

.... [insurance] ... this part needs explanation.

Dont want reveal too much as it is an ongoing police case with drunk driver going to court and me meeting solicitor tomorrow. But my understanding right now (early days) is that after BLB have given verdict on damage to my completely mangled bike and value of replacement, the checque from drivers insurance company will be written out directly to BLB. The alternative, as I understand it, would be to get out all my receipts and then claim back every part one by one as I buy replacements - would take ages. Personally I think going trough BLB is a much better option.

Are BLB frame builders? ...

Not sure what it takes to qualify them as "frame builders" but yes, they offer track frames of any geometry, any tubing, any colour. BLB lead time is 4-6 weeks rather than several months with Bob Jackson.

... I mean surely the framebuilder will choose a tubing specifically to fit your need?

Yeah... but then again.. were talking about BLB here right? Nice chaps on the whole, but doesnt hurt to get a second opinion. And still haven`t fully decided wether I want OTP or custom. If custom made with lighter tubing means more vulnerable frame, then perhaps a sturdy OTP (Orlowski?) is better.

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On the whole, I am not looking to exaggarate my claim or fleece the insurance company in any way. The bike I lost was not bad at all so the replacement value quoted BLB is only fair. And I'd much rather have the old bike back than to go trough all this hassle.

Not sure what it takes to qualify them as "frame builders" but yes, they offer track frames of any geometry, any tubing, any colour. BLB lead time is 4-6 weeks rather than several months with Bob Jackson.

Bob Jackson lead time may be a little longer than that, seeing as they've gone out of business and been bought out by Woodrups. Although word is Woodrups haven't got the rights to the frames, anyone else know owt about this? Also, did Bob Jackson still have the rights to build Hetchins?

starfish and coffee..... got some issues about being tied in to one bike company , and having the insurance co. make out check to them, sounds you could get ripped off ! they can quote what they like, you have to buy it from them !!!!!!! is it me, or is this a stitch waiting to happen ?

photo 1.JPG by monomaniac(tom), on Flickr

photo 3.JPG by monomaniac(tom), on Flickr

photo.JPG by monomaniac(tom), on Flickr

first test ride - tis smoooth, just need to retape the left side of the bar and set up the front derailleur...
forgot how slippery a new brooks can be though and new tape looks whack, it will darken down to the same honey as the saddle in no time

And in Columbus land, seeing as I am not very heavy and presumably not very "demanding" (whatever that means) I can choose SL over Cromor?
Might be a price issue though mind you, I'll find out next week.

EDIT: They don't seem to make SL anymore, but supposedly there is plenty left in the market?

Oh, and lugged versus welded. Do I care? Should I?
.

there are some SL tubesets available to builders but i don't think that there is a
builder that will suggest you SL for commuting at your size.

try to be more accurate about your needs to your builder.
At 52 you can achieve low weight and stiffness just choosing proper tubes
and lugs, not paying much.

If it's not a matter of cost, just ask for a mix of steel that resist corrosion,
at 52 you will notice more differences depending the builder than the tubeset.

prefer welded only if you don't like lugs or you like the looks of OS tubing.
You can even ask for welded standard tubes at 52 (OS headtube) but i think
that will give you more flex than any other.

Typically weights at 52 are close to 1600gr with SL, i don't think that you
be much heavier even if you choose the worst tubeset available.

A proper briefing to your builder will give you the most i think.

Dont want reveal too much as it is an ongoing police case with drunk driver going to court and me meeting solicitor tomorrow. But my understanding right now (early days) is that after BLB have given verdict on damage to my completely mangled bike and value of replacement, the checque from drivers insurance company will be written out directly to BLB.

So blb haven't quoted yet? So there's still time to go somewhere else?

starfish and coffee..... got some issues about being tied in to one bike company , and having the insurance co. make out check to them, sounds you could get ripped off ! they can quote what they like, you have to buy it from them !!!!!!! is it me, or is this a stitch waiting to happen ?

you don't know brick lane bikes? it's a shop. I'll purchase parts for the listed prices, not more. and why should I be bargain hunting on the internet to save money for some shithead who ran into me with his car? not sure why this could be a stitch and why I'd want to go elsewhere. most importantly brick lane bikes has the stock I am after: Phil, Sugino, Nitto, Brooks etc. it's just the frame I am unsure of.

Doesnt matter for you, but I guess the insurance company leave themselves a bit wide open - bike shop can quote what they like, and upgrade your parts a little here and there, and apparently guarantee a sale.

Also, I know this isnt possible in your case, but wouldn't you rather get (say) a £1000 quote at 'listed'' prices for a bike, get the cheque then spend that £1000 in planet x's (or equivalent) sale?

sorry starfish, i do know blb !!!!!! but if they have what you want, fine......... not sure about the 'custom' part of the frame, but hey ! as long as you get what you want ! i would of used this opportunity to get a really good frame and pay for the parts myself ! that what i mean but not being given any real choice by the insurance co...............i suppose blb are just like any other east end 'fixie' skidder *hipster 'londons famous london' bike shoppe....... so similar to somewhere like brixton bikes, for instance !
+++++plus what christianspaceman said

we'll get back to the discussion of how to handle insurance when you guys get run into too. in the meantime I'll take advice on frames please.

EDIT: OK, sorry that I got a bit grumpy there. just been trough a shit experience which still hasn't been resolved, your off topic patronising wasn't helping.
common practice is that the insurance quote is written after a specialist shop (or similar) has seen damaged propety first hand, so online stores are out of the question. yes there are ways you can tweak and arrange an insurance payment to work for you, especially if you are friendly with the bike shop in question. but if I was about to do that it's not the sort of thing I would discuss on an online forum.

Now back to "current projects" please.

I've taken that bar tape off now and will replace with another white tape, bought the chain but was waiting till I'd taped the tubs properly. The stem is on how I bought it.. will ride this way and may change to the right way round if I can

Just built this Nigel Dean 531 up, still got a few bits i want to replace, but useable for now.

Intended to build it SS, but the frame came with mechs & crankset that were useable, so will run it geared for a bit. Needs some tan hoods.

Nigel Dean 531 by Hallsy01, on Flickr

Ignoring the ridiculous brooklyn i'd thought we'd seen the death of, there's nice work on this page.

Ignoring the ridiculous brooklyn i'd thought we'd seen the death of...

Philistine.

we'll get back to the discussion of how to handle insurance when you guys get run into too. in the meantime I'll take advice on frames please.

if i was getting it bought for me by the insurers i'd go for columbus spirit or reynolds 853, in the oversized version, tigged, fillet brazed or lugged. try and test some bikes, see if you like the ride/weight/stiffness/whatever, although they should all be fairly comparable at the same price range. as said before the way the bike is built will have a big impact.

in terms of columbus cromor (i think you asked a question earlier?) - this tubeset and the others you've mentioned are worlds apart: i have a cromor frame and it is fairly stiff for steel but also heavy, whereas spirit and the like are much higher end tubesets which are very light, and can be very stiff as well.

double butted, triple butted, let call the whole thing off.

i have a cromor frame and it is fairly stiff for steel but also heavy, whereas spirit and the like are much higher end tubesets which are very light, and can be very stiff as well.

There is an incredible amount of bullshit put forth about steel, and subjective discussions of stiffness absent any kind of objective testing are often at the heart of it.

So, for the millionth time, all steels have essentially the same stiffness. If you want a stiffer steel frame, you have to go oversized or use really heavy wall thickness. If you don't change the geometry (including tube diameters), a 3kg mild steel frame will be stiffer than a 1.5kg 953 frame.

There is an incredible amount of bullshit put forth about steel, and subjective discussions of stiffness absent any kind of objective testing are often at the heart of it.//

//a 3kg mild steel frame will be stiffer than a 1.5kg 953 frame.

you are normally better informed. are you not well? lacking some sleep?

2 identically dimensioned frames in tube O/D and wall thickness but one made from cheap cro-mo, the other a high end steel will have the same stiffness because the dimensions are exactly the same* one will be stronger than the other due to it's better materialproperties.

it's these properties of high end steel that enable thinner walls for the same strength and that results in a lighter frame. as long as you don't go silly so that the tubing beercans at the slightest provacation

*yes there will be differences but very very small so of no consequence.

all frame materials have different qualities.

buy the one you prefer.

simple.

The dean looks lovely. Saw a fixed version of that very frame outside peckhams loveliest deli today, very fetching.

I caught a glimpse of the previous pages brooklyn at the protest the other night at it was also rather fetching. Not sure I'd go for one for the money it would cost. Then again I say that about everything as I'm a tightarse.

If you don't change the geometry (including tube diameters), a 3kg mild steel frame will be stiffer than a 1.5kg 953 frame.

you are normally better informed. are you not well? lacking some sleep?

2 identically dimensioned frames in tube O/D and wall thickness but one made from cheap cro-mo, the other a high end steel will have the same stiffness

That much is true, but I thought it didn't need spelling out that the one which is twice as heavy necessarily has the greater wall thickness. Are you not well? Lacking some sleep?

it's these properties of high end steel that enable thinner walls for the same strength and that results in a lighter frame.

Also true, but this has always been at the cost of reducing stiffness.

Of course, there has also always been an equal amount of BS about how much frame stiffness you actually need. Even in super thin walled 753, the old fashioned 1⅛" OD down tube & seat tube with a 1" top tube yielded a frame stiff enough to have satisfactory handling in a road race geometry, although even the heavier 531 could be a bit marginal with touring loads and the correspondingly longer tubes. The problem is easily solved by adding ⅛" to all the main tube ODs, with scarcely any increase in the total amount of metal employed.