Are OTPs approaching custom standards?

In a related matter.

Are the big name companys, trying to jump on the percieved steel road bike revival, failing badly?
Steel road frames have always been around OTP or custom, and at least some 'ready to ride' bikes have been available.
But recently (OK a year or so ago) people like Evans and Wiggle started stocking OTP steel road bikes, and I for one was disapointed in the builds. No-one expects NOS campy on an OTP production bike, but at least components which are in keeping retro style of the frame.

e.g. Bianchi dolomiti (Evans)

   Kona Kapu (Wiggle)

(the Bianchi is quite nice, but the black parts just look out of place to me)

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In a related matter.

Are the big name companys, trying to jump on the percieved steel road bike revival, failing badly?
Steel road frames have always been around OTP or custom, and at least some 'ready to ride' bikes have been available.
But recently (OK a year or so ago) people like Evans and Wiggle started stocking OTP steel road bikes, and I for one was disapointed in the builds. No-one expects NOS campy on an OTP production bike, but at least components which are in keeping retro style of the frame.

e.g. Bianchi dolomiti (Evans)

   Kona Kapu (Wiggle)

(the Bianchi is quite nice, but the black parts just look out of place to me)

Good point--I haven't been paying that much attention to what chains stock, but I like it that they're at least going in that growing niche direction of classic-looking bikes. I hope it remains the case that such bikes sell better again and that the range and quality improve. (The reason why I bought my fixed/ss bike wasn't because it was fixed/ss (I had to have that pointed out to me ... oh) but because I liked the way it looked, it was so cheap (OTP), and I had some money. Now of course I'm very glad I 'discovered' fixed that way, but yes, it was via the classic connection in my case.)

Possible OTP pr0n? Ciocc Mockba '80 pista reissue for $999USD apparently

^^ Taken from the Porn thread.

If this trend continues, that Condor (Paris, Galibier), Fixie Inc., and now the Ciocc Mokba 80 are following,
then the aesthetic bar for the upper end of OTPs is being considerably raised.

Not saying "as good as", because thats subjective. But this effort is definitely a bit classy.

http://ciocc.it/pdf/catalogovintage2009.pdf

But it's still not fitted to your dimensions :)

But it's still not fitted to your dimensions :)

Yes, you are quite right. They'd buckle/crumple/give up the ghost, if I rode them.

All the more reason for me to stick with aluminium, till I can afford a nice steel set up, thats designed for my weight, and riding style.
Good point. Now, I will kill you. Veronique should have warned you of the dangers of me sitting on you.

;)

Here's my only beef with the (opt) I assume that is out of the package?

Here it is, most of the companies that sell bikes are merely assemblers if that really most are marketers.
Fuji, Pake, Surly, SE, Gem Pro, probably your Club, and a lot of the other "high end" bikes are made by one manufacturer in Taiwan. Maxway. They do a great job, and make quality products at all levels. Here's the rub, the frames cost 50-100 bucks from them (powder coat, and graphics included). If you have a relationship with them and can take a container of product, And most of these bikes are sold as something special from a company you trust at 800 usd. and above. Pinarello is made in Indonesia. If you buy them from the manufacturer complete that 2000. bike is about 600. usd.

I don't mind buying a otp bike that is relatively close to my exact optimum geometry. What I do mind is getting duped by some marketing company into believing it's something special made by Italian craftsmen.

As a matter of fact I am about to buy one of their frames myself for a build I'm doing. But I will be damned if I will buy it for the 800.usd that SE charges for it. Got it for a lot less.

While I think the OTP was right for me at the time, and I still believe they are a strong option for first time buyers, I know the next one I have won't be. The same happened with my MTBs: first was an OTP, the next 4 or so all built up, or taken apart and rebuilt ad-infinitum. Already the plans are forming in my brain: frames, colour schemes, tyre choices, bar options. I love it

But as I say, an OTP is a good platform for first-time buyers

did we decide anything yet?

did we decide anything yet?

haha, chances.

Has this been posted yet?

Subrosa Malum Fixed, about £570.

I must admit its the most DIY looking OTP ive ever seen, looks like some fixie trix kid bodged it together.

£570!? Bloody hell.

From the Maxway website

"We currently supply to global customers. Many of them are reputed bicycle assemblers, such as Jamis, DMR, Ritchey, Surly, Salsa, Dawes, Greenspeed, Rans, VooDoo .... and so on."

Hmm. VS looks like you were spot on.

From the Maxway website

"We currently supply to global customers. Many of them are reputed bicycle assemblers, such as Jamis, DMR, Ritchey, Surly, Salsa, Dawes, Greenspeed, Rans, VooDoo .... and so on."

Hmm. VS looks like you were spot on.

of course he is spot on. how can this be news to anyone?

As a matter of fact I am about to buy one of their frames myself for a build I'm doing. But I will be damned if I will buy it for the 800.usd that SE charges for it. Got it for a lot less.

How much, and how (if you can say)?

Here - http://www.londonfgss.com/thread17568.html

@sohi - ouch. Ignorance is obviously not bliss on my part.

Here - http://www.londonfgss.com/thread17568.html

Thanks, Andy--couldn't find answers to either of my questions in the thread, though?

Getting closer yet?

Bianchi Pista Via Condotti

pikeys stole my lizard when I was a little boy.

Getting closer yet?

No.

The assertion remains as dumb now as it did then.

Rephrase... "Are M&S suits approaching Saville Row standards?".

No, they never will. It's not just the materials or colours... it's the fit, it's the bespoke nature, it's the personal preference and attention to detail.

Didn't this thread die? Why is it back?

if it had a quil stem yes, lookslike a unipac stem though

Getting closer yet?

Bianchi Pista Via Condotti

No.

The assertion remains as dumb now as it did then.

Rephrase... "Are M&S suits approaching Saville Row standards?".

No, they never will. It's not just the materials or colours... it's the fit, it's the bespoke nature, it's the personal preference and attention to detail.

Didn't this thread die? Why is it back?

Velocio, clearly, its my belief that Saville Row and Mercian (for example) are over-rated. Its my view that OTPs, in my eyes, are approaching made-to-measure. I think the Colnago Super Single Speed is a good example actually, as is the afore-mentioned Ciocc Mockba 80. If that goes against the grain, then I'm sorry, but it was only my opinion.

I added comment to this thread because I feel that efforts by Kona, etc, are making made-to-measure harder to justify for SOME (but not all) people. Since you disagree with me so strongly, I think this thread has outlived its usefulness. My opinions on such bikes shall now be a private matter. I won't express them here any further. Consider me "told". I live and learn, so its all part of the process.

Who keeps a bike for 20 years?!

I will never sell my MF

Only 19 years 6 months left to test this

Bilge. Colnago or Bianchi's latest efforts might look half decent, but they're still someone else's choice of colour/fit/detailing, and the components are selected on the grounds of profitability, not asthetics/function.

The Class War. Elitists on one side of the room, staring imperiously at the poor misbeguided sods on the other side of the room.

Barbour Jackets vs. Primark raincoats.
Rapha vs. LIDLs cycling socks.
Vanilla bikes vs. Giant Bowerys.

Me? I'm common, and proud to be a Primark/LIDL/Bowery fan.

Its not like I truly do not see the beauty of handmade.....as I'd love a pair of John Lobb boots.

GA2G The Oscillator. That's me.