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i kind of agree with object there.
one of my bike started out as a stock plug, but now the only remaining of the original parts is the frame, even though it looks nothing like a plug now, it will allways be a plug. ( and even SuperTed had to ask what it was) -
You can't make that statement without backing it up with some reasons why you disagree.
I see it being about value judgements.
Some share similar values, and their judgements regarding aesthetics and quality, and desirability may be similar (vis-a-vis HHSB owners).
Others, maybe like me, have a different set. Whereas I see bicycles as a mode of transportation, and an exercise tool most of all. Others may see them as also reflecting their personal style statements.
Both, to me, are as valid as the other. I am not proud of my bikes, but am happy with them. I am dispassionate about metal, but far mor passionate about food (though no-one would ever guess that).
Therefore, I would prefer a few top-end OTPs to many fully Custom-Made bikes. I don't feel that my ego needs that type of massaging, as much as my legs and gut need the exercise, and my bank balance needs the TLC.
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I don't even know what you people are talking about. Buying an OTP Mercian and specifying the colours does not make it a custom frame, right?
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Others, maybe like me, have a different set. Whereas I see bicycles as a mode of transportation, and an exercise tool most of all. Others may see them as also reflecting their personal style statements.
speaking of how certain people have a certain view of riding their bike, this remind of of a quote I heard a while ago;
A Zen teacher once asked his students why they rode bicycles. One said he rode to carry potatoes. Another cycled to observe the world. A third said it cleared the mind, and a fourth said cycling put him in harmony with all sentient beings. The Zen master was pleased, but when the fifth replied, “I ride my bicycle to ride my bicycle,” the teacher sat at the student’s feet and said, “I am your student.”
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^ The voice of Ray Shins
Er?
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this forum has turned into one big rant!!!!!!!!
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a big GAYotplangsterlizardspok
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Who keeps a bike for 20 years?!
I've been using my hack bike for 18 1/2 years. Getting there!
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I've been using my hack bike for 18 1/2 years. Getting there!
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSmSTpRUeLs"]YouTube
- Only Fools and Horses Heroes and Villians Triggers broom[/ame] -
I see it being about value judgements.
Some share similar values, and their judgements regarding aesthetics and quality, and desirability may be similar (vis-a-vis HHSB owners).
But nobody has said that there couldn't or shouldn't be an OTPHHSB. All you've asked and we've subsequently discussed is whether OTPs are approaching the standard of custom bikes.Again disregarding custom frames as you've stated that you meant customised bike(spec etc), they cannot even be compared as you are not me and we are not person A and person A is a different cunt to girl C etc.
It's all relative, we all have different opinions. If you chose to build your idea of a perfect bike for yourself (custom) I am not guaranteed to love it as much or even like it at all. Just as you may dislike something about a bike that I would choose to build/ride.
It is about choice. I can create the concept of, then subsequently purchase my own idea of a perfect bike. This is what custom built bikes are. An individuals own choices culminating into a ridable end product.
You can do exzactly the same for yourself, again all your own choices. It will be your imagination creating your perfect custom bike.Given a similar budget would two people ever end up building identical bicycles? And I mean identical right down to the choice of innertubes! Given the practically limitless possibilties of component combinations available, I'd suggest not. Yet thios is exactly what an OTP is, one person dictating (whether looking at trends or not) what people will purchase. You buy an off the peg and it is someone else's idea of what a bike should be.
An OTP manufacturer may be able to make a bike which appeals perfectly to one person but not another. How do you justify which of the people are correct?
This is the only difference between a custom thing and an OTP. Choicechoice
(chois) Pronunciation Key
n.- The act of choosing; selection.
- The power, right, or liberty to choose; option.
Others, maybe like me, have a different set. Whereas I see bicycles as a mode of transportation, and an exercise tool most of all. Others may see them as also reflecting their personal style statements.
Both, to me, are as valid as the other. I am not proud of my bikes, but am happy with them. I am dispassionate about metal, but far mor passionate about food (though no-one would ever guess that).
Therefore, I would prefer a few top-end OTPs to many fully Custom-Made bikes. I don't feel that my ego needs that type of massaging, as much as my legs and gut need the exercise, and my bank balance needs the TLC
There is no obvious way that I can disagree with you on this as it is your own personal opinion, a custom thought if you will rather than an OTP thought, i.e. media influenced. However, you must admit that this presents a portrait of your own opinion of the difference between an OTP and a custom bike. I would ask one question though, if you are so insistent that a bike is a mere piece of metal and not something to be adored why do you give a shit in the first place whether OTPs are approaching custom bikes. If there are but an extension of your ego, something which you present the appearance of rising above, why start this thread in the first place. Surely it can't be for the validation of other peoples opinion.
Let me state clearly my own viewpoint. I build and ride beautiful bikes some of whcih I treat poorly considering the amount of enjoyment that I gain from them. Other of my bikes are looked after more carefully but all are an extension of who I am. Not because of how they appear to others or how many photos can be placed on the internet proudly displaying them to all like a cheap hooker at the side of the road but because they shape my life. I plan and organise events around cycling, I travel by bicycle wherever possible. They have all provided me with a positive experience. This is something that can be gained from any bike you ride, whether it be OTP, custom, borrow or some shite you found in the shed of a house you've just bought. But I do like my bikes to look a certain way. I do have ideas of my own aesthetic and I do everything I can to get to that but not at the cost of useability, I prefer the aesthetic of my drop bars but use pursuit bars because they are so damned comfy (for me)to ride. I buy the best quality components that I can, if I can also get something that I find pleasing on the eye I do that. I do not look to others for validation of my choices as I build bikes for me, but other people comment on my bikes from time to time and I would never insinuate I don't enjoy this too. It's the same reason I wear the clothes I wear, style my hair how I want to get the piercings I have and select my tattooists very carefully and on my own terms.
Whether you like it or not, whether you agree with it or not, other people (though not everyone) will always judge you by your choices and/or outward appearance. This is the difference that choice makes, you can adapt the external appearance of your posession to portray as much of the internal you as you choose to.
- The act of choosing; selection.
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The ship of Theseus springs to mind. (Natch.)
Raleigh Lizard?
No. ;)
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o rly?
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o rly?
I prefer CDG myself.
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About
Are OTPs approaching custom standards?
Posted by
@GA2G
I find it objectionable for people to compare personal choice (within the bounds of availability/existence) to corporate made "choices".
You can choose to do something your own way or you can choose to not do something at all. Buying a finished product and then claiming it as a custom artefact is a blatent lie. The only choice made was whether to purchase or not in the first place.