That Starmer fella...

He is in this thread.

Yes, you’ve made it abundantly clear it’s an issue for you..

But it’s not for others.

Respect that.

With battles like this ongoing it's another 20 years of Tory rule. FFS

Exactly this!!!

And those promoting the battles can’t see that they are, by effect, enabling the ongoing Tory clown show!!!

Sunak thinks the Equality Act is a Trojan horse for woke nonsense? Fine, the issue is Labour!!!

The thread is for opinions on Starmer, otherwise what's the point of it? I didn't realise it was 'Post how much you like Keir Starmer or sod off', but clearly I've misread it.

I mean, why have a thread on it if you're just going to lament that there are differing opinions on the matter?

Mods, we're done here. No dissent allowed. Stans only.

You do understand what I'm saying about second readings, right? Here's Diane Abbott telling people not to slag Corbyn for abstaining on the second reading of one of the more mental Brexit policies: https://twitter.com/HackneyAbbott/status/1089927254816313345

I'm as anti brexit as they come but I never suggested that their abstention at second reading somehow meant they were 'pro Brexit'.

This is just what opposition parties do.

EDIT - scrub that, pointless as discussion is going nowhere

I understand perfectly. I'm not sure you get what I was saying, but hey ho.

Closet leftie he is; my bad. God help him when the newspapers catch on.

Starmer needs to go. Prove me wrong. Labour is fucked.

I guess the big question is who could come in and unify labour?

I don’t know if there is anyone, but starmer has proven that he’s unfit to lead the Labour Party.

I'm not a fan, but he's not a Tory, and as much as he might be a centrist dad, way too right for my personal opinions, wet paper bag of a man, he's not a fucking Tory, and he's not right wing and he's not a fucking Tory. I wouldn't choose him over many people, but most of the people I'd choose him over are fucking Tories. There's going to be very little of my tongue left but I'll take him over more fucking Tories if that's the stupid fucking binary we've got. Not that I give a fuck if people shit talk him on here, he deserves half of it and it doesn't affect anything.

The system is the problem, not the party leader. Squabling over who the right leader is ignores the real problem.

End adversarial politics and get rid of fptp. Build a new parliament that is setup for discussion and negotiation, not conflict and bellowing.

Starmer can be wherever anyone wants him to be on the left to right scale in a consensus based government with representation for all voters.

Parklife.

I follow too many like-minded critical people from the Labour left on Twitter who tend to make things seem a little bleak, so I'm grateful for the balance in this thread which makes me think that Keir Starmer might just be playing a patient long game rather than just not being very good.

Who can I follow on Twitter that might also be a bit more optimistic?

I definitely agree with @snottyotter that as dispiriting as things may be in the Labour Party, and as sad as it is to see a genuinely transformative and popular set of pledges abandoned with the "Nick Clegg excuse", Labour in power in any guise is always going to be preferable to any Tories.

And Keir Starmer's tactics are going to have to change when the new PM gives the Tories a bit of energy back, and I'm interested to see what he'll do.

Can’t help but feel someone fairly bland could become an increasingly popular option after the total chaos of the last 4 years.

Trying to predict anything is impossible but I doubt he’ll win an election by outwardly appealing to lefties on a cycling forum

In your opinion.

I quite like him. Is he the best thing ever? No but I'd vote for him (not my MP etc... Etc...)

Given that Labour continue to build a lead in the polls, how much more of a lead would Starmer need to gain before the left of the party accept that actually, Starmer is the best hope to avoid 10 more years of Tory rule?

Id have to hold my nose to vote for him too but where's the better option?

I hear plenty of people on the Labour left saying that Starmer isn't doing well, the Tories are doing badly, but they aren't prepared to accept that Corbyn only did well in that GE because the way the Tories were handling Brexit.

Edit: not aimed at you in particular

Given that Labour continue to build a lead in the polls, how much more of a lead would Starmer need to gain before the left of the party accept that actually, Starmer is the best hope to avoid 10 more years of Tory rule?

This is the thing. For some people (not accusing anyone in this thread) the further Starmer gets ahead in the polls, the more that's proof that he doesn't represent any real kind of change as he's no threat to the 'establishment' etc etc.

So not only is there no point where those people would accept it, it's slightly worse in that the better he does, the less he deserves your vote.

I agree, but marketing Boris as a threat to the establishment did him a world of good!

Even if you want someone left of Starmer, use him for the next election and then manoeuvre. He’s doing well on the ‘being electable’ front, which is quite important!

If the goal is a labour gov asap, trying to remove him now will not help.

no left wing party would have a chance in hell of winning an election. None.

I know mentioning 2017 is controversial to some people, but Labour got closer than a zero chance in hell of winning the 2017 GE, despite the torrent of smears and infighting.

This idea that all left of centre policy is toxic is received wisdom at best.

Nandy on a picket line:

https://www.joe.co.uk/news/labour-frontbencher-lisa-nandy-joins-picket-line-in-wigan-351489

We all know she's not going to be sacked as long as she can avoid making up policy on the fly during an unauthorised interview while pretending to be her own boss. The picket lines are not the problem.

And yet starmer will be slammed for double standards when he doesn't sack her. Even though they were really clear about why Sam Tarry was sacked.

The picket lines are not the problem.

I'm honestly confused. All the news outlets say he banned frontbenchers from joining picket lines, did he not?

Keir Starmer’s office told shadow cabinet members that to “show leadership” frontbenchers “should not be on picket lines”.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jun/20/keir-starmer-tells-labour-frontbench-they-should-not-join-rail-strike-pickets

Is it because the CWU is an affiliated union?