Tourney: Greif Masters 2011

It seems strange to me that London gets its own team, and is allowed onto the England team. If there was one England team, and London took all the places, that would be understandable, but to have its own team and also potentially dominating the England team too, seems a bit excessive.

If the aim is to split areas up roughly according to player numbers (I don't know that it is, but that is the gist I took), it's like saying London has more players than the rest of England combined, which I also don't know is true or not, but I guess not.

It's the same debate as city/country selection for the Euros. Merit or representation? The former is better for London players, the latter non-London players. I see the justification for both sides, but being from Birmingham, of course I'm going to argue for the latter.

Also, it should really be a UK team, at least in terms of opportunity. If it gets selected according to merit, I don't see any Scottish players making the grade, but if not, who knows?

I guess in this 'drafting' format, a lot of pressure is put on the team captain. There's a marked absence of people putting their hands up for that!

like saying London has more players than the rest of England combined, which I also don't know is true or not, but I guess not.

London has well over 100 players, over 70 players have competed in one of the London Leagues, over 50 players play 2 to 3 times a week, it's probably quite even.

A non-London coach for the England team solves the problem, no? Or just ban London from the England team (and call that team ROE), that seems pretty harsh though... I agree it's the age old argument of inclusive versus merit, why not ask Karlsruhe for more guidance/input as they may be able to make an impartial decision?

The rest of UK should get their names down, and if there aren't enough players, then they can be subsidised by London players that didn't make the London draft.

^ exactly what I was thinking

I guess in this 'drafting' format, a lot of pressure is put on the team captain. There's a marked absence of people putting their hands up for that!

put yourself forward for captain, coach then don't pick any london players...easy!

I don't think i'd play for an england team if there was no tactical coach looking after the team. For me it's a coaching role not a captain playing role. I'd want a tactician making the calls at the right time. A captain has self interest of playing.

I'm sure Hannes will not object if you want to take a "coach" with you.
That person coach and dont play, so if someone is happy to pay tickest and not play, i'm sure it will be cool with everybody

Yeah, Karlsruhe's involvment would be good. And it's their tournament, so they can run it however they like. I'm just putting across my opinion while things seem to be up in the air.

You're probably right about even numbers playing in London vs Rest of England, so I think it would be totally fair to have a London team and a 'Rest of UK' team. One player from each city perhaps? Would make a fairly rubbish team, but could be entertaining...

For what it's worth, Birmingham is now getting 10ish players playing twice a week. I'm sure Cambridge and Manchester are bigger than us, so right there we have 30-50... Anyway, that's a separate discussion.

Agreed, ROE scenes (roughly by size):
Manchester
Bristol/Bath
Cambridge
Birmingham
Newcastle
Norwich
Nottingham
Brighton
Leeds
Dublin
Oxford
Coventry

Quick glimpse at the Newcastle thread, seems Birmingham is way more active. I can shed some light on Coventry: nobody has ever played a game there. We have one regular who makes the trip over 1-2 times a week. She's trying to kick it off there, but to no avail.

Oh, Lalou's suggestion is good. No objections here.

might as well take it to the ROE forum

Dan, there you go... thread#

you just need to sort out a deadline for the votation on the captain

Thanks Rik. I've started a thread on the Birmingham forum, and will tell people about it at games this week.

The rest of UK should get their names down, and if there aren't enough players, then they can be subsidised by London players that didn't make the London draft.

simples.

Hermm ... but it's never simple ... probably missed something :/

release adrienne!

*I guess in this 'drafting' format, a lot of pressure is put on the team captain. There's a marked absence of people putting their hands up for that!

*^Hardly agree with that. Don't know why it seems that everybody agree so easily to a non-democratic system. Put all the responsability on the captain or the coach for the selection is too much, and look like a presidential system. Give all the power to one guy and wait that maybe he did what you expect good.
You could easily imagine that: London get is own draft captain system. Then every player who stay after the selection can be into the england team, but don't get a vote for the england draft. Rest of english players choose 10 people all over england, including londonian. If majority thinks that the England team should have londonian plus a london team, they gonna get pick. If not, not. But not all the decision is on the hand of one men.

I'm setting up a Greek team

Yeah, Karlsruhe's involvment would be good. And it's their tournament, so they can run it however they like.

see this:

Forming the Teams:[/B]
Every country has 1 week to tell us a captain (we don't care about the process). If a country can't find a captain, we choose one out of the country for them.
The captain has to organize his team as soon as possible. If there are some Americans willing to come, They can play as an extra player (max. 1 per Teams). Just in case some people want to travel transatlantic.

Referees:
Every team has to bring one referee (he has to ref 4 games and can be a player)

fuck this draft shit, lets just get a list going for the england team?

That is a draft? You can't honestly think it's fair to do first come first served, you'll have a team full of internet guys!

The rest of UK should get their names down, and if there aren't enough players, then they can be subsidised by London players that didn't make the London draft.

I see where you're going and i think its very reasonable. However, the way i wanted to do it in my tournament, is that anyone can put themselves in any draft. But only one! So its strategical, if you think you are more likely to get into one draft over another, definitely makes it interesting.

Shit Chukker could do what he wanted and put himself in the swiss draft and see if he gets picked! Gormley could put himself in the Benelux countries..

Im letting uolmo pick the london team and the roe team, seems as if hes got it all figured out

Isn't a draft where multiple teams all get picks for a pool of players?! As such the roe captain and London captain should be fighting for the same players (where there's crossover)?

And the same for players like yorgo the nation spanner (as in he spans nations, not he's a wrench the size of a country), if they fall within the top ten of two teams it should be decided by draft rounds...

Ditto, I have no idea how the draft will work considering the geographical boundary restrictions? Normally you're all meant to pick from the same pool of players, everyone tries to nab the best players first, gazumping ensues, etc.

In fact, max, I see room for a second bench minor this year... No national boundaries. Everyone who can make it signs up to a players list and a group of coaches (n=players/10) all take turns at picks.

Is there a tourney in march?

Can next year's Greif Masters be a 5-a-side grass polo tourney?

+1, "Fuck Yeah, Indoor, on Grass"