Cycling Fitness / Training Advice

Great thing about track is if you're on the limit, you can just keep saying to yourself "just one more lap.. one more lap" and before you know it it's 10 to go..

.. business time!

Base is so much more pleasurable than tempo too :)

Yeh we had a couple of A Group league guys really pushing the last 10 laps. I was in some kind of weird trance by that point just trying to hold on (just one more lap!!)
I think we/they basically did something like a 21.30 for a 10 looking at my data.

Problem is it's a little addictive I find.

Nothing wrong with that. Weird that trance thing - to be so blocked out and yet so alert at the same time. I often get that in longer races.

Tempo is base ;)

I think my average IF for training would be around .85 right now. Off maybe 14h a week.

For me, now - z2 is base :) z3 is effort...

I'm often the same in a TT. I struggle to recall much detail of certain parts of the ride when I'm really on it.

4h high Z2 is a proper effort.

I'm trying to build a decent base at the moment, having lost a chunk of fitness back in Sept/Oct. Work hours are insane (70 hour weeks the norm), so time on the bike isn't easy to come by.

My question: Is 2/3 hours at tempo going to give me the equivalent of a 4/5 hour ride in z2? I'm basically trying to replace a long Sunday ride with a less long turbo session.

It doesn't work like that. Apples can't be compared with oranges.

But 90min at 80% FTP and increasing as possible is a hell of a workout.

Or 45min at 90%.
Ot 1h at 90%
Or 3x20 at 90%.

Just do what you can for as long as you can. But an hour of good work is all you need.

You might need to drop the % if you aren't good at riding the tubro or haven't ridden it much recently.

You don't need to do 4/5h at Z2. If I did that, I'd be broken. Do 2-3h at proper Z2. So 65% to 80ish %. Just pushing on all the time. Could even then throw in a 15min effort at the end or 2x10 min int he 2nd hour. Just get creative.

Understood, cheers.

Interesting that my Suffer Score (sorry only using HR on Strava) from 90 mins MTB'ing at Cannock Chase yesterday of just over 100 was very similar to that of a 3 1/2 hour lumpy easy ride a couple of weeks ago.
I know which one hurt more and was way more fun.

I can't face constant effort on the turbo.

Been doing a low(ish) intensity climbing vid or two. Hopefully they'll count as Base.

Alternating high cadence drills, and low cadence grinds, on the turbo seems like things I'll benefit from at least.

Yeh I've found mixing cadence to b useful (also boredom relieving).
Doing sweet spot intervals I'll hit one at 105-110rpm then the next at 65rpm then sometimes I'll ride a pyramid going up and down the gears in an interval maintaining power and adjusting cadence accordingly.
I find going from low rpm's to high quite tough.

Hopefully they'll count as Base.

I doubt it but then you don't really need a base if you like to blow up after four hours ;-)

Ironically that blow up was on a designated Base ride.

Would have been fine if we'd stopped for cakes as promised.

Maybe i should focus on training at carrying and consuming cakes.....

Training peaks question.

I used to have a coach and I notice that although she is no longer coaching me, she is still linked to my training peaks account.

I'm inclined to remove her, but she has set some useful sessions in the past that I wouldn't mind replicating in the future. Will removing her also remove all the workouts that she has previously added to my schedule or will it simply remove her access to my account?

Will doing 2x20 at FTP or just over every week at the Velo Park, as well as one 4+ hour "club pace" weekend ride from now until August when I switch to hill reps during the week be any use at all? The only thing I'm really targeting is hill climbs in October. Riding the Nationals this year.

Nothing wrong with a bit of AeroCoaching ;)

Personally I've gone well off fewer hours than most for 10-50 mile TTs, down to 4-5hrs per week in years past. I'm about double that now as I've managed to mitigate some of the horrific saddle issues I'm prone to, I train at Newport 1-3x week and keeping the short work in year round does pay dividends. There's a tendency for people to only do sweetspot (I hate that term! Makes it sound magic) training and nothing else for TTs which is wrong: if you don't know how to train then fill your boots and just ride at 86.2% FTP all day or whatever, but you'll hit a plateau and then go nowhere after that.

Incorporating short stuff will STILL target the right energy systems for TTs and efforts 1-3hrs in length, even when the power is mad high and you're only doing 20-40sec. People make the mistake of just looking at power output during a session and saying "oh that's way higher than my 10 mile TT pace so it's not helping my 10 mile TTs". I just did 3 flying 500s yesterday afternoon at the track, and today I'm going to do 4x2km as long as my leg holds up. Targets for next year are 10-50 mile TTs as well as track, it all helps.

Clients of mine occasionally raise an eyebrow when they have 40sec repeats in the depths of winter but when they emerge and have +10-25w on their FTP for the following year it makes it worth it, you just have to manage it effectively. Being a drone on the turbo definitely a bad idea as you've noted!

Should stay. Or just write them down in your own workout book on the side panel.

I hear you Xavier.
Not poo-pooing anything you do as it clearly works but I often see lads spending a fortune on kit and little else.
I think the point I was trying to make was that equipment alone isn't the answer. Good solid training costs little and often reaps higher rewards than just spending cash on kit, certainly at club level anyway.

Getting to your point about hitting some high end stuff in the winter, I've started adding short 30 second, flat out sprints to the end of my sweet spot intervals on the turbo, just to hurt my legs a little. Hopefully it'll keep me a sharper.

SQT's at Derby when I can and some MTB'ing without looking at my data until after the ride also helps as pace is often dictated by faster riders which is always good IMO.

Yes, dropping epic cash on bikes is nice but there are better ways to approach it. Building Rich's TT and HC bikes this year was a good example of that, the HC bike was ~£800.

Have a play with some maximum unpaced work as a full session in itself - when I coached the Uni of Birmingham squad one of their turbo sets was 4x70sec unpaced (ie as hard as you can from the start, no changing gear or resistance) with about 10min rest. Absolutely brutal when you get it right and an excellent session for developing a range of energy systems, plus no fancy kit necessary as it doesn't matter what power you do, you'll be spinning >120rpm to start and then just clinging on.

Adding work at the end of endurance sets I'd reduce the duration - make it 3x10sec sprints rather than 2x30sec. Doing those will actually improve growth hormone secretion and in a weird roundabout way can help you recover better within your program. In the past we've had someone inadvertently drop weight doing these as testosterone levels can rise as well.

I loved the HC bike you built, very purposeful and great to see with the TT bike that you don't need £5k minimum to compete (win!!). I've raced that 10 course a few times as I'm local to it as I'd cringe if I had to take an expensive bike on that road surface!!

Being new to the track (and single speed) I love riding fixed and quite fancy knocking up a commuter next year around a TT frame to replicate my TT position. Any concerns training fixed a couple of times a week? I race on a standard 10 speed set up.

I'll certainly give those max efforts a try. I only have a simple turbo, no PM and trainer road so things tend to be simplistic but I like it that way (until I can justify a PM).
So a maximal effort session would include 4x70 second efforts with 10 mins recovery between? I find I need at least 15 mins to warm up these days!!
I can creat that one on TrainerRoad. So just absolutely nail it and hold on even if your form (inevitably) tails off?

Coach gets me to do those workouts once a week (well 60s with 8 mins rest). They are brilliant. Every week you can go a little deeper and because of the longer recovery periods you get really good quality efforts without being in a hole afterwards. Only thing holding me back is my rollers moving all over the shop when I get over 700w.

My fixed gear TT bike is super ghetto and I've won opens on it! Just choosing the right bits really.

I've mentioned it on the TT forum in passing but I wouldn't ride fixed all the time in training, especially if you race on gears. No problem a couple of times a week though of course.

Yes that's right - you will be absolutely creeping at the end of them, best case scenario you get someone to call 20sec splits to you or create an audible cue on the computer, as otherwise you'll instinctively wind down towards the end.