Which Groupset?

Beat me to it!

oh dear.

I think EPS still isn't really finished. ;-)

My point being Campagnolo developed it themselves. That's a lot of work for a small company.

When was EPS commercially available?

Yeah looks like commercial availability wasn't until 2012. Di2 was in 2009.

So what you are saying is that Campag had the longer development period, and still can't bring new iterations to market at the same speed as Shimano?

Yes because they are a smaller company, and decided to focus on 11spd instead of EPS.

Are you even listening at the back?

An interesting turn of events happened that changed the order of which company introduced electronic shifting to the market first. Campagnolo’s 10-speed electronic shift components were ready for the market in 2005, and it planned to introduce them. However, after a successful Giro d’Italia campaign with Illes Balears-Caisse d’Epargne, a number of the bikes failed to shift after being driven to Trento in driving rain at 150kph. The system worked after it was dried out again, but this is exactly the kind of thing that keeps electronic-shift engineers awake at night. This snafu stopped the progress dead in its tracks, as the company had other fish to fry and could not afford to devote resources to this project at the expense of its core business.
It continued to work on the system, but slowly. In 2009, Campagnolo introduced 11-speed drivetrains at a number of price levels, so all of that changeover, performed in secret, required the undivided attention of Dal Pra and other engineers.

Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/11/bikes-and-tech/technical-faq/lennard-zinn-the-20-year-history-of-campagnolo-electronic-power-shift-eps_198080#qIVZqBKB3tZLv5qB.99

But at least Campag have now got an EPS group with hydraulic disc brakes, an EPS hub gear, and- oh, wait

^^^ No. What I am saying is that they are still trying to compete on performance and technology.

^^Means nothing, if you can't get it ready for release, you can't get it ready for release.

^^^ No. What I am saying is that they are still trying to compete on performance and technology.

And, in that case, manifestly failing, in public.

Now you are just beeing ridiculous.

How so? They're about three years behind Shimano at this point, in terms of products available in the market.

And, in that case, manifestly failing, in public.

?

Isn't SRecord EPS the lightest electronic group?

I have no idea, possibly- is lightweight the pinnacle of technical development?

No. But it is has been the selling point for top end groupsets for years.*

*along with marketing/winning grand tours.

We get that you like hydraulics and discs and thats cool but jeez.

On a similar serious note i could say that campy builds stuff for riders and shimano for commuters..

Top end/prototype groups- nice halo products, but where is the Alfine Di2, the r-785 hydraulic disc brakes, the 105 Di2 that is coming shortly?

On that note, the disc braked 105 group is a great example- bringing in options at all levels.

To Bjorn's point- you mean Campag builds stuff for dentists, and Shimano builds stuff for people who want to ride their bikes in all conditions?

Have you read the article? It's not about domination of OEM.

It makes a case for Campagnolo surviving as a business.

Yes since we are on that level of conversation, sure that would fit right in there

To Bjorn's point- you mean Campag builds stuff for dentists, and Shimano builds stuff for people who want to ride their bikes in all conditions?

Down at my parents with the Penguin at the moment, wishing it would stop raining.

I also need to get to the post office for a BB, which will be Wednesday now.

Irony level over 9000

Have you read the article? It's not about domination of OEM.

It makes a case for Campagnolo surviving as a business.

I've not read the article, I was responding to Jeez's assertion that Campag was at the cutting edge of tech dev

fucking hell this is exciting.

Irony level over 9000

Don't make me humiliate you in a game of bike

Is that where you weigh all the components and divide it by the amount of time it took you build the bike? You'd be in trouble.