Analog film photography and cameras

@ EdwardZ,

the point I was trying to make, wasn't that technology doesn't change what we produce, but more that however you choose to use the technology, it should never be a case of "this is better because I use it, therefore you should"

@ EdwardZ,

the point I was trying to make, wasn't that technology doesn't change what we produce, but more that however you choose to use the technology, it should never be a case of "this is better because I use it, therefore you should"

Since you agree that technology effects the result then following a masters use of technology can be called learning.

The East Germans had a saying "von der Sowjetunion (Sieger) lernen heisst siegen lernen". This translates as "learning from the Soviet Union (victors) is the way to learn to be victorious".

Depends on how you define master, and who you consider in this thread to be one.

hey look, a photo!

olympus xa / ektar / -7°C

Developed my first roll of 120 last night. Nothing had prepared me for how much more difficult it is to get the fucker onto the reel than it is with 35mm. Anyway, 2 hours of sweaty hands inside changing bag I finally managed to get it on.

Now, this particular roll of film had been sitting inside my Yashica for about 5 years. I cant even remember if it was already in there when I acquired it, its been that long

I got it out of the loft about a week ago, saw there were 4 frames left so shot them just so I could get a new roll in. I didn't want to throw the thing away cos for all I knew there could have been something good on there.

Anyway, trying to wind the thing onto the reel, i could feel it sticking in places but didn't think much of it. Also, bear in mind that my fingers had been all over this thing by the time I'd managed to get it on so I was expecting scratched negatives at the very least.

When I'd finished developing and peeked into the tank, a massive chunk of the film was white and puffy and pretty much broke off as soon as I handled it. Looked a bit like the leader on 35mm, not sure if this is normal.

Then, as you can see by the photos below, its like the paper backing has been stuck to the emulsion. Only the last 3 frames survived, although on close inspection of the negatives there is a faint hint of the numbers from the paper backing on them too.

Not sure if this is something I've done wrong of if its simply the fact its been sat in the camera for so long.

Rouen's Epiphanie tournament is always the first tournament of the year. Many teams try out new line-ups before the summer season really kicks off. Hooks, a local team to Rouen who help organise the tournament, have won the tournament the past two years. This year's win was particularly poignant as it may be the last Epiphanie they play together. Good times had by all.

^^ very nice shot, tilts to the right though.

(...) its like the paper backing has been stuck to the emulsion. Only the last 3 frames survived, although on close inspection of the negatives there is a faint hint of the numbers from the paper backing on them too.

Is there indeed paper on the negs or are the numbers just exposed on the film?
I had this once when I got a 120 out of the camera in bright sunlight (protective wrapper not shielding the light enough).

Tough crowd! There's lots of angles at play there: the court is on a slight incline, left to right; the court is elliptical, so it curves round on the right-hand side; and the roof is not perfectly aligned with the court – not that any of that was considered when I took the picture.

Lovely shots, first one especially.

Don't mind the lines on the second, would look too dead if they were perfect

No offense intended!
To me the whole thing just tilts, whatever lines are at play.
Look at it flipped -

@Tina: Just the numbers exposed onto the film.

I'm just curious if this is my own doing with the fumbling around in the changing bag (I did make sure to put the film in the tank and close it if I needed to take my arms out of the bag) of if its just a product of the films age. I'm sure being left half exposed inside a TLR for 5+ years, temperature fluctuations, etc can't have helped.

Doesn't look to me as if that happened in the bag, or that it's due to films age.

it's due to film age - same happened to me with very old (Agfa) film.
to be correct, the film had no fog at all but the fumes from the printing ink on the paper did affect the emulsion "exposing" the numbers and some arrows, too.

Looks like light leaking through the backing paper, can happen with red safety windows I think.

Looks like light leaking through the backing paper, can happen with red safety windows I think.

Depends upon the emulsion. I think it was a moisture storage problem. I've developed film to excellent results that were exposed more than 50 years prior. The latent image does tend to fade with time but a little extra agitation and time to push the density up does well. Images, of course, end up a bit grainy and with higher ambient fog but still extremely printable. I, in fact, like the look.
5 years in the camera? That's nothing. Many people used to shoot like that... typical colour photographs developed in drug stores tended to include all 4 seasons on a roll and then some...

As to loading... Get yourself a Paterson or Jobo reel. Or.. if you don't develop a lot of film.. a Rondinax 120 box.. The Rondinax lets you roll the film into the machine and develop in daylight.. And if you develop a lot of film.. Forget the bag.. Get a changing box! Bags are good for loading film into a camera but a torture trying to load a reel and a sure path to frustration..

@Tina Kino, none taken. But now that you mention it, the tilt is almost hypnotizing. It's like someone has put a pin through the ball and twisted the photo, I think I like it.

.

CON LOS TERRORISTAS!

queue heavy baseline

Do The Harlem Shake

a massive chunk of the film was white and puffy and pretty much broke off as soon as I handled it. Looked a bit like the leader on 35mm, not sure if this is normal.

doesn't sound normal! was it indeed the paper?

... a Rondinax 120 box...

I have a query about the Rondinex system - specifically, I have inherited a Rondinex 35U, which requires 200cc of developer compared with 290cc per film for a Paterson tank. On the few occasions I've used it, the negatives have come out looking under developed - should the strength of the developer be increased in the same ratio as the reduction in volume? I.e. the same amount of developer per film irrespective of volume of water?

I have a query about the Rondinex system - specifically, I have inherited a Rondinex 35U, which requires 200cc of developer compared with 290cc per film for a Paterson tank. On the few occasions I've used it, the negatives have come out looking under developed - should the strength of the developer be increased in the same ratio as the reduction in volume? I.e. the same amount of developer per film irrespective of volume of water?

What you need to keep in mind with the Rondinex is that

• it accepts little developer (200 ml)
  
• that it uses a form of rotary agitiation
  
  

Some developers and dilutions are ill-suited. Rodinal, for example, demands a min. of 5ml concentrate per film. This means that 1+50 is about as dilute as one should generally go-- with, of course, exceptions.

Continuous agitation (as the Rondinax) provides lower development times than inversion. A good starting point are the values published in the "Massive Development Chart". Since rotation speed and style have an influence on density its just a starting point-- one anyway needs to adjust to the gamma you want for the enlarger (different illumination sources demand different levels of film densitry) or scanner.

@edwardz: i have both Paterson and Jobo tanks / reels. I could definitely do with a bigger changing bag though, mine gets really cramped with everything in it.

Never used a Rondinax though, I might have to look for one the 'bay. They look quite nifty. Good shout

Ok thanks - I'll read more then try again.

@edwardz: i have both Paterson and Jobo tanks / reels. I could definitely do with a bigger changing bag though, mine gets really cramped with everything in it.

Get yourself a changing box. A few years ago when all the mini-labs shut down the market for flooded with them. Should still be able to find one at a reasonable price. Should the market have dried up--- and all those not squirreled away ended up in landfills--- one can easily make one.