Lance Armstrong... greatest doper there was or ever will be

Doping as an amateur for 'enhancing' what exactly?

Cycle competition isn't actually important unless you're a professional (or close), or you've really lost perspective.

...did Edscoble fixed-tour a pan y agua?

:)

Bigger, Stronger, Faster documentary is on Youtube and has loads of the examples above of musicians on beta blockers, Tiger's eyesight, the massive US Athletics 80's doping cover ups, interview with Floyd Landis etc.

What about amateur sports?

If I found out someone cheated to beat me I'd punch them in the cock and make them eat their own bike with only brown sauce to garnish.

I fucking love brown sauce.

Doping as an amateur for 'enhancing' what exactly?

Cycle competition isn't actually important unless you're a professional (or close), or you've really lost perspective.

No no, you misunderstand.

I don't care for doping for sports... I dislike the deceit, want a level playing field, etc.

But... doping for personal enjoyment. To basically enhance the body, mind and senses such that a 60 year old could feel like a 30 year old or something. Performance enhancement to improve life quality.

HGH for improved eyesight seems reasonable at a glance. Especially since its such an instant improvement. Having to stick to an additive to keep the gains is not however

To basically enhance the body, mind and senses such that a 60 year old could feel like a 30 year old or something. Performance enhancement for to improve life standard.

How do you feel about plastic surgery?

I fucking love brown sauce.

I fucking love being punched in the cock

all this talk of dopinbg in other sports

is there any other sport where the athletes put themselves through as much effort and all out exhaustion as cycling
the effects of drugs in cycling is much more than in gold / tennis soccerball

obviously it will assist athletes in their training and give them an edge but i don't think any tennis player puts in as much effort in a year as the winner of the tour de spain put in on that tour alone this year

No no, you misunderstand.

I don't care for doping for sports... I dislike the deceit, want a level playing field, etc.

But... doping for personal enjoyment. To basically enhance the body, mind and senses such that a 60 year old could feel like a 30 year old or something. Performance enhancement to improve life quality.

Oh I see. There are legitimate use for most of these drugs as medication hence the nice packaging and Amgen's profits. No moral dilema there, knock yourself out.

How do you feel about plastic surgery?

I have no issue with it.

I tend to find people who have had it done uglier, but those are probably outliers who went too far. For the most part I don't have issue with what anyone does to their own body, and I view plastic surgery as not that much different from tattoos, body modification, etc.

I guess that view will fan the flames.

But so long as someone isn't hurting anyone else then I don't care what they do. And in the case of cheating in sports and the deception involved, that is to hurt someone else. But outside of sports... no issue with doping, and certainly no issue with plastic surgery. That's not for me, but I'm fine with it.

all this talk of dopinbg in other sports

is there any other sport where the athletes put themselves through as much effort and all out exhaustion as cycling
the effects of drugs in cycling is much more than in gold / tennis soccerball

obviously it will assist athletes in their training and give them an edge but i don't think any tennis player puts in as much effort in a year as the winner of the tour de spain put in on that tour alone this year

A doped and talented athlete will beat a talented athlete.Given the depth of talent at the elite level in men's tennis, it is pretty clear that physical and mental fitness determines who wins.

None of this is rogue medicine though, the stuff has gone through pharma trials and testing. It's just banned as a performance enhancement.

Used wisely and within parameters of the field trials and your own physical capabilities. Why wouldn't it be low risk and enhancing?

They've been tested for medical use, not for everyday use to make you look slightly prettier. Say the alternative is death, then some side effects will be acceptable. You might not think the same when you're having your heart restarted or your face has grown into odd proportions because you've been taking too much hgh or whatever.

I just find it interesting regarding what's considered acceptable.
For example, EPO and blood transfusions are banned but training at altitude or using an altitude chamber to sleep in in order to increase your blood count aren't yet they have the same effect.

They don't have the same effect though.

Everyone can train at altitude. Not everyone is willing to risk their health to the same extent to win and nor should they be required to.

Cycle competition isn't actually important unless you're a professional (or close), or you've really lost perspective.

I disagree.

But... doping for personal enjoyment. To basically enhance the body, mind and senses such that a 60 year old could feel like a 30 year old or something. Performance enhancement to improve life quality.

I'll let you know what I think about this in 30 years.. :)

in golf / tennis soccerball

These aren't sports.

Have people only just started to consider other sports have doping problems?

Darts has a major doping problem, allegedly.

Hacky sack, on the other hand, is super clean.

But... doping for personal enjoyment. To basically enhance the body, mind and senses such that a 60 year old could feel like a 30 year old or something. Performance enhancement to improve life quality.

People do this all the time. They dope to go to sleep, to wake up again, to relax, to stop headaches, to dance longer (although that's considered naughty) and for all manner of other things.

I disagree.

I was waiting/hoping someone would pick up on this. I'd probably 'train' better and ride quicker if my view on that were different.

IMHO the financially comfortable dopers in the veteren's classes are examples of racers who have got things really twisted. I can see how they get there but's it's surely just egomania.

Hacky sack, on the other hand, is super clean.

Are you being personal?

Are you being personal?
Isn't this the hygiene thread?

Did anyone listen to the Radio Five show last night? Ashenden and Dick Pound were interesting. They made it abundantly clear that doping isn't isolated to cycling. Ashenden said he couldn't bring himself to watch the Olympics. Still hoping this is something the media pick up on.

It can be downloaded here

Peddlers: Cycling's Dirty Truth

Mon, 15 Oct 12
Duration:
112 mins
Mark Chapman lifts the lid on the secret world of drug abuse in cycling. With contributions from former Tour de France cyclists Tyler Hamilton, Matt De Canio, Christophe Basson. Lance Armstrong's former soigner Emma O'Reilly tells us about an abuse that was rife inside his US Postal Service Team during their period of dominance. British cyclist David Millar also outlines how the present and future of the sport are a different proposition.