Lance Armstrong... greatest doper there was or ever will be

236 is not 500

Stop being so pedantic, Lance is still the second most tested American cyclist with the surname Armstrong.

what experience do you have of the courts?

Aw come on man, you know I'm trying to leave that all behind me.
Why do have to go dragging that up?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/kimmage-uci-needs-root-and-branch-surgery

Possible reep:

http://cavalierfc.tumblr.com/post/30172302298/its-not-about-the-bike

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/kimmage-uci-needs-root-and-branch-surgery

very good article

236 is not 500

And he passed all of these?
Either
1.) he wasn't taking anything making him the greatest cyclist of all time.
2.) he was taking somthing making him one of the greatest cyclists of all time and one of the greatest criminal master minds of our generation.

Im not sure which one of these options would make me worship him all the more.

And he passed all of these?
Either
1.) he wasn't taking anything making him the greatest cyclist of all time.
2.) he was taking somthing making him one of the greatest cyclists of all time and one of the greatest criminal master minds of our generation.

Im not sure which one of these options would make me worship him all the more.

I suggest you read one of these:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/kimmage-uci-needs-root-and-branch-surgery

Possible reep:

http://cavalierfc.tumblr.com/post/30172302298/its-not-about-the-bike

And realise it's option 3.) An arrogant cheat with help on the inside.

No glamour, no class, just a lot of money and a superiority complex.

And he passed all of these?

Define 'passed'; he tested positive, but had the positive results covered up by bribing the judge

Either
1.) he wasn't taking anything making him the greatest cyclist of all time.
2.) he was taking somthing making him one of the greatest cyclists of all time and one of the greatest criminal master minds of our generation.
3.) he bribed the judge

You don't have to be a criminal mastermind to avoid punishment, you just need money and a biddable judge.

This is why Lance is a distraction, and the real crooks need to be hounded out of cycling before they destroy it.

are you referring to the UCI, other (team, sponsor, rider) bigwigs?

As in Lance's demise is followed by mostly silence from the insiders of the cycling world, or just nonsense quotes from them

I really want to see the case that the USAD brings to the table. At the moment everyone one is jumping to he did this and he did that. We havent seen the evidance yet.

While I am sure he is a bit of a prick (as are quite a lot of driven people) and probably took drugs, I am not sure he is quite the criminal mastermind he is made out to be.

If the USAD proves he was in fact trying to take over the wold then there is a great hollowed out volcano in Auckland waiting to be used for a lair (he can also offer a good lifestyle to prospective minions, not to mention some great riding).

Also, the stripping of the tour titles dosent seem right to me. If that happens then they could start retrospectivly stripping titles all the way back when. Like Coppi said, 'I only dope when I need to' when is that? 'most of the time'. Lance wasnt the first to win the tour while off his chops.....

I am not sure he is quite the criminal mastermind he is made out to be.

Is anybody really making him out to be a criminal mastermind? The evidence in the public domain so far doesn't point in that direction, it points to a grubby little crook who got away with things because grubby little crooks who were supposed to be policing the sport were bought off, either with direct bribes or with the self-aggrandising prospect of being in charge of a bigger sport if they kept sucking on the American money teat.

I think he is a criminal mastermind.

A real criminal mastermind is someone who manages to steal a very large sum of money but is never, ever caught.

Or Murray Walker on TV's famous 'Mastermind' when he proclaimed his specialised subject to be "Formula one!" then proceeded to get pretty much every question wrong. That was fucking criminal.

I think he is a criminal mastermind.

But do you love him or hate him?

Also, the stripping of the tour titles dosent seem right to me. If that happens then they could start retrospectivly stripping titles all the way back when. Like Coppi said, 'I only dope when I need to' when is that? 'most of the time'. Lance wasnt the first to win the tour while off his chops.....

Remember that during the time when Lance was racing, they wanted to rid the sport of doping (but failed as word are empty promises), whether in the past, it was considered normal to dope in order to ride the TdF, even the people understood thinking that there's no way you can go through those mountain and not doped.

There is a difference between mild simpamina and flasks of coffee and jacking your hematocrit to 50% plus.

I really want to see the case that the USAD brings to the table. At the moment everyone one is jumping to he did this and he did that. We havent seen the evidance yet.

You will.

While I am sure he is a bit of a prick (as are quite a lot of driven people) and probably took drugs, I am not sure he is quite the criminal mastermind he is made out to be.

Only Tommy thinks he's a mastermind. Most people have the opportunity to be deceitful in their jobs for more money or glory but choose not to (because they're not pricks).

If the USAD proves he was in fact trying to take over the wold then there is a great hollowed out volcano in Auckland waiting to be used for a lair (he can also offer a good lifestyle to prospective minions, not to mention some great riding).

Where's the ambition? Lance would go for at least a full invasion of the North Shore where he'd cycle his Trek along the seafront signing children's foreheads and mother's breasts. There would be lots of Livestrong billboards featuring the leader's face and the wearing of wristbands would be compulsory. The wearing of yellow would be encouraged.

The volcano island Rangitoto would be a prison for Floyd Landis to wander, eating birds eggs and cutting his feet on the sharp black rocks.

Also, the stripping of the tour titles dosent seem right to me. If that happens then they could start retrospectivly stripping titles all the way back when. Like Coppi said, 'I only dope when I need to' when is that? 'most of the time'. Lance wasnt the first to win the tour while off his chops.....

The podiums were full of dopers so it's not hugely important who Wikipedia says won what, so long as some truths are learnt and there's some accountability.

Is this a re?

The Sunday times are going back over their original Libel case.

http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=1&storycode=49916&c=1

The Sunday times are going back over their original Libel case.
Someone's managed to paint themselves into an awkward little corner, it would seem.

Same story with his insurance payout.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/kimmage-uci-needs-root-and-branch-surgery

Possible reep:

http://cavalierfc.tumblr.com/post/30172302298/its-not-about-the-bike

Thanks chaps both really interesting reads.

Morbidly, I want to read the comments/arguments of the more informed Lance doping deniers - like watching a car crash. Where are they all?

I re-read in full the Paul Kimmage & Floyd Landis interview from NYVelocity.com last night. Fascinating and tragic stuff. Well worth another read if people have got a spare few hours. Trouble is, I don't believe anyone on the subject of doping any more - sifting the truth from the lies will now be impossible forever and LA will always deny. There will never be closure. Shame.
http://velocitynation.com/content/interviews/2011/landiskimmage

But do you love him or hate him?

I think he needs calling out... Very bad cyclist, Lance.