Tubs

you are not wrong .. my rear has couple of small cuts which I've sealed with superglue .. I like them as they are supple and have latex inner. They have already lasted longer than Strada that I had. If you can get the contis at the same/less price and if they have latex inner then go for them.

I thought I read that Conti's only use Butyl and that they only manufacture tubs with latex inners for pro-teams at special request.

Yep Butyl only from what I'm reading.......seems to be a problem with wear if you lock up the rear

http://www.thetallcyclist.com/2012/06/review-continental-sprinter-gatroskin-tubular-tyres/

Gatorskin tubbies are fine and nothing like their - shit - clincher brethren

This.

The only thing it share is the name.

Thanks and @Howard. So current thinking is these wheels with the Conti Sprinter Gators.....

Any thoughts appreciated. Worth it over Zondas +GP4000s or not is the question for fast riding/racing.

http://www.superstarcomponents.com/en/pave-tubular-ultra-11speed-wheelset-2024.htm

Dunno. What benefit were you after?

They'd be slower.

For Hog Hill Crit racing mainly......so reps of short sharp climb followed by uphill sprint finish.

Got some V sprint 50mm carbon wheels on the way with Veloflex Roubaix to go on for dry conditions. Probably don't want to ride/race with these in bad conditions so it's a question of whether tubs is worth it....or just keep things simple with clinchers.

You've answered your own question.

I thought I read that Conti's only use Butyl and that they only manufacture tubs with latex inners for pro-teams at special request.

Correct-- Conti does not "believe" in Latex inner-tubes.

Any thoughts appreciated. Worth it over Zondas +GP4000s or not is the question for fast riding/racing.

If you are "racing" I'd forget about the Zondas. Even in Cat-IV I'd not bother. Then again for "racing" I'd completely avoid the Sprinter Gatorskins-- the regular Sprinters are not bad (and they are even cheaper). If it is about reliability-- and especially if your are racing-- then I'd trade up to the Competitions.. They are lighter, robuster, ... (but also more expensive)..

If you are "racing" I'd forget about the Zondas

Why

So to give a bit more context......taking the crit/road racing a bit more seriously. Proper training regime, eating right etc....

Goal is to escape cat4 asap on 8 points so need a 5th before the end of November. Then target is to try to get up to Cat2 which is only really going to happen on courses with hills. I'm good on hills especially punchy ones/bad at sprinting. Then want to do some road racing....

can I get Tufo Extreme Tyre Sealant anywhere off the shelf in London or do I have to order it in?

Condor used to stock it. Might be worth giving them a call.

Anyone know if Dugast tubs (cotton Pistas in particular) have removable valve cores?

My rhinos do

Dugast tubs (cotton Pistas in particular) have removable valve cores?

I imagine so-- at least the current incarnation. There are, of course, many valve extenders that don't need to have the core removed-- I'm assuming you want to use the tyre on a deep section wheel (the standard 38mm valves are, of course, too short) and not use sealant (something that you really never want to use on the track)..

So to give a bit more context......taking the crit/road racing a bit more seriously. Proper training regime, eating right etc....

For most crits I think a well built 32 or even 36 spoked shallow section wheel-- think old school track-- with a properly glued tubular (perhaps even going to use a bit Terokal) is the best way to go. You want typically wheels that corner really well-- why clinchers are a shoot in the leg-- and you want wheels that can go through pot-holes and at speed (depending upon the course and locale perhaps even coblestones) and deal with the junk thrown up on the course (including other people's wheels). Sure deeper section wheels are more "aero" but you'd be perhaps better off with an aero helmet-- I suspect most of your competitors won't be wearing them and probably even riding clinchers on low spoke count boutique wheels..

This is all bollocks - stick to tub chat Ed

This is all bollocks - stick to tub chat Ed

You mean it is not consistent with the fashion at the MAMIL bar?
(I suspect I've had longer experience on deep section carbon wheels than ANYONE here.)

Spoke count matters more than rim depth

I keep reading this - Are there any stats anywhere? All Crr tests these days seem to be testing clinchers.

Bicyclerollingresistance.com has started testing tubs
http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews/continental-competition-2016

Bicyclerollingresistance.com has started testing tubs

Looking at what they wrote they'll not get anywhere. Their methodology is quite ill-suited to get a meaningful comparison. Back about 15 years ago Jobst Brandt tried to do some tests but beyond demonstrating the impact of cement type and technique on rolling resistance he did not, I felt, get meaningful results either.. He believed to show that clinchers had lower RR than tubulars. Back then a friend was working with a number of elite cyclists and Continental and they got significantly different results. A poorly mounted tubular using glue tape, of course, won't deliver good rolling resistance but at the elite level tyres are neither poorly mounted nor do they use tape...