Weight / Fat loss

humans only began an diet based on agriculture 12,000 years ago which is not long enough for any real evolutionary adaptation

BABOW, try again.

http://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpage/Evolutionary-Adaptation-in-the-Human-Lineage-12397

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolution#Recent_and_current_human_evolution

78.5kg now.

This weight loss malarkey is a piece of piss... just avoid ice cream and beer.

That's really interesting, as is your comment further down. Not sure if i agree though.

I wasn't attempting to go 'paleo' or anything, but I bonked spectacularly yesterday through not paying enough attention to my eating on a century whilst out with a few others.

Basically, I just hadn't eaten nearly as much as I normally would have, and the result was me nearly having to push my bike up Central Hill to Cadence in Crystal Palace as I could hardly see properly or keep my bike in a straight line.

May have been other factors, but I'm pretty sure it stemmed from a lack of carbs

I'm pretty sure it stemmed from a lack of carbs

Lack of available energy. Such is the way, you might have tons on your body but it just cannot burn it fast enough for it to be available.

This is where pre-ride pasta (the evening before, or a 5am pasta breakfast) and things like flapjacks (with raisins) really help.

It's not a carb in > carb out equation... it's the speed at which your body can convert the carbs into useful energy.

Bonking is the depletion of all available energy immediately available in your digestive system, your body will have already shifted into burn all the fat mode (great for weight loss), but it's useless... burning body fat is such a slow process that the crunch hits, your body can't deliver the energy it's using and is actually using more energy desperately trying to burn your fat... result? A hard bonk.

You're spot on about lack of carbs, but there's no point loading up on slow carbs in advance you just want the stuff you can burn quickly.

BABOW
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ba+bow

BABOW?

Fair enough, a single generation is only needed for an evolutionary effect.
So let me rephrase - the 90% of human evolution before farming, will likely be dominant over the 10% since.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evol­ution#Recent_and_current_human_evolution­

Anatomically modern humans first appear in the fossil record in Africa
about 195,000 years ago, and studies of molecular biology give
evidence that the approximate time of divergence from the common
ancestor of all modern human populations was 200,000 years ago

Bruce - in short, it is unwise to make decisions on limited evidence - even if the evidence is obtained empirically.

eg: Recommend a low fat calorie restricted diet
results: western obesity

We don't currently have a complete understanding on what diet is optimal for human health, so noone should make any empirical recommendations.

Eitherway.. im 8% body fat and my mate is triathlon world champion.
so BABOW!

FFS I live off ice cream and beer.

"My mate", really? That's a comeback?

If the western diet was actually calorie restricted, there wouldn't be "western obesity"

Perhaps they should 'recommend' it as the solution more vocally.
Highlight all the physics behind it, that proves it works.

Highlight all the physics behind it, that proves it works.

Physics ≠ biology + chemistry.

A hell of a lot is known, where there is uncertainty it's due to the almost infinite range of variables. Not all humans are the same, not all food is the same, combinations of things react differently.

Hand-waving as if the human race knows nothing just because we collectively don't know everything isn't particularly constructive.

Such flawed thinking is why people think you're a troll, there's a collective "eh? serious!?". It's hard to even reason with a viewpoint that is so one-sided and extreme that it sounds a little crazy.

Oh, and the above... the infinite permutations of variables... is why I don't really buy the whole Soylent movement. It's not that we don't know enough in general, we just cannot apply generality to anyone in specific.

It is the diet our bodies are designed by evolution to eat.

That's a fantasy. There was no single Paleo diet; you're taking about the time when humanity spread over most of the planet. The diet changed dramatically for different groups (and hey, we're adaptable) partly because of their migration and partly because of technological change, which affected what they could eat and how they prepared it. There is no evidence at all that any one of the varied diets being consumed over that period was something that humans had specially evolved to eat. It's a supposition. The argument that any of those diets is automatically better than a healthy modern diet is also completely without evidence. We live longer and have completely different lifestyles. Carbs became a large part of the human diet because we started doing much more physical labour, for example. It was a smart thing for manual labourers to eat. That's changed again for developed nations in the last 100 years, but we're still living a very different life. Paleo man rarely survived past his mid 30s, so his diet could have been full of things which exacerbate senile dementia, osteoporosis or type 2 diabetes and it just wouldn't have mattered. Matters a lot to us.

And none of this is being debated in the paleo fan club, many of whom are just too in love with the fantasy of being a modern caveman. Paleo is the tribal tattoo of the diet world. In fact, if you see a guy with tribal tats in the gym, he's very probably eating Paleo. And while the diet itself is probably quite healthy for most people and certainly better than the standard diet, it's just not good to have a diet whose rules are determined by pseudo-science which is being defended for emotional reasons rather than being properly studied.

Babow?

Physics ≠ biology + chemistry.

Epic troll of all chemists and biologists out there.

Bruce you are correct there is no single Paleo Diet.
Which is one of its strengths and makes it easy to live with.
However none of them included refined carbs.

There is no evidence at all that any one of the varied diets being consumed over that period was something that humans had specially evolved to eat.

Other than the fact we are alive today

We live longer and have completely different lifestyles.
Paleo man rarely survived past his mid 30s

Do you have citations for these beliefs?

Do you have citations for these beliefs?

Alright... too much trolling. You may leave this part of the site.

Palaeo, please. We're not in America.

Palaeo, please. We're not in America.

Can you cite any evidence for this claim?

I THOUGHT NOT

Can you cite any evidence for this claim?

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/palaeo-
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/american_english/paleo-

You want to lose weight?
Eat less, do more exercise.

this is factually incorrect and a big problem for people to grasp

Yes, yes, these dictionaries are completely fascinating but the evidence I was asking for was evidence that we're not in America. Your weight loss is affecting your troll-sensor, matey.

I always think the Italians got too much credit there, but Christopher Columbus did a get a little lost and managed to mistake Cuba for China.

Yeah, but when in Cuba, the Cubans mistook my wife* for Chinese. Therefore Columbus was right. QED.

Babow!

*American, but of Japanese descent.

Well I suppose I had better send my 1st class BSc in Archaeology and Palaeoecology back to the Russell Group University from whence it came due to the glaring spelling mistake. Coz Bofferz sez.

And mine too it seems

Although I think I might actually be in America. This was yesterday's dinner.

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Well I suppose I had better send my 1st class BSc in Archaeology and Palaeoecology back to the Russell Group University from whence it came due to the glaring spelling mistake. Coz Bofferz sez.

Are you looking at my bra?