That Starmer fella...

I'm very glad to know we're not going to be walking into the culture war rakes that the Tories Labour Party Members have been so good at laying at our feet.

ftfy

(as evidenced by the posts following yours)

He's a fucking useless bellend. More interested in disciplining his own mps over than standing up to this utter shitshow of a government

Who would you have as leader and why?

Personally, I’ve no idea. No-one stands out, and there’s no credible left-leaning candidate. I thought Starmer would at least be the sort of detailed examiner of Johnson and be able to pull him to pieces but he’s not even done that of late.

I think Owen Jones nails it this week, stop focussing on Boris as he's about to go.

I think starmer has been doing a more than decent job. You can't do more than "this isn't quite right, please explain" right now because of the situation.

I think he is allowing Johnson to self destruct and playing it low key.

I think starmer has been doing a more than decent job. You can't do more than "this isn't quite right, please explain" right now because of the situation.

.

Jesus. The bar's been set pretty low, hasn't it?

Starmer has at every turn allowed the Tories to set the agenda, sometimes even encouraging it (in this case undermining the teaching unions in the process—win win).

Who could have predicted how this might turn out??

More recently, the Tories are about to put thousands of people out of work; where are Labour?

Sunak said this, and to be honest I agree with him. The Labour strategy of optics over politics is meaningless.

We've then got Nandy's quite drastic swing to the right on social issues, the rhetoric of which is more than a bit worrying:

Coupled with her admission that the pledges on raising income tax for the top 5% of earners and renationalising public utilities would be dropped.

And they're not even level in the polls... Not sure how people think Starmer's Labour is doing a great job to be honest

How are they polling compared to the start of the year?

Hasn't the electorate been clear enough? They don't want the politics of momentum.

All those voters in previously labour seats, what do they want?

I don't know but the pandemic is generating enough headlines to keep attacking the government with. If as the party of opposition, with a media stacked against you, you push too hard on this, the media will swing and focus on you. It's about pushing gently and watching the tories tear themselves up. This is before our trade deal (or lack of) comes into play.

The goal is to look competent. Surely?

They are now edging towards saying they will give Nicola Sturgeon another Indy essentially for the votes. I dont think I'll ever vote labour again, they are dead in the water. Joker

Ex-Corbyn loyalists approvingly posting hot takes by Rishi Sunak has to be the weirdest thing about 2020.

I think Starmer has done an excellent job. I think it's especially excellent given the sheer volume of unfair criticism levelled against him by failing blogs like Canary and Skawkbox, desperate to paint the guy as some kind of far right lunatic. I don't think he's got everything right - I think he could stand to show a bit more passion and really focus on the Tories more than on Johnson - but compared to what we had before it's night and day. We're level with the Tories for the first time in years, and those stats are only going one way.

I think in a way it's a mark of the guy's competence that those blogs have to lie about him - paint him as pro torture, or dismissing BLM as a 'moment', or what have you - and I think the sooner they go under the sooner we'll have a left wing government again. It's blown my mind how it's always those same blogs who were so horrified that parts of the party machinery undermined Corbyn who've been spending their 2020 undermining Starmer. Irony not big in the blog world I guess.

Yeah you're right, we need the Torys for another 5 years after this, they'll sort out the mess.

I'm not a Corbyn loyalist, don't straw man me.

I don't have time to engage with all these points right now, sorry. What I would say is that I just don't think this tactic of attacking the Tories on 'competence' is one which is going to be particularly fruitful. It's not because of 'incompetence' that the Tories keep handing out contracts to companies like Serco, and it's not because of incompetence that they took so long to lock down in the first place.

If, as someone suggested, Boris is on his way out, and someone who appears more competent (which obviously won't be difficult) takes his place, where have Labour got to go, if their whole mantra is that the Tories are effectively doing the right thing but in the wrong way?

Also, it's not exactly a lie to say that Starmer came across as dismissive of BLM in that interview—the most significant political mobilisation of a generation. It's also patently not a lie to say that he abstained on a bill that can effectively decriminalise war crimes, even if it was only in its second reading.

How those are weaponised by tabloid-style blogs with comparatively tiny readerships is pretty irrelevant to be honest. Like you I would rather they disappeared.

Tories looking like they're on the ropes and beatable - hang on, great time to have a Labour internal bun fight!

Lol, that is a fair point.

Also, it's not exactly a lie to say that Starmer came across as dismissive of BLM in that interview—the most significant political mobilisation of a generation.

It's also pretty far from the truth. I watched that interview. He was not in the least bit dismissive. He clearly meant 'moment' in the 'pivotal moment' sense.

It's also patently not a lie to say that he abstained on a bill that can effectively decriminalise war crimes, even if it was only in its second reading.

It's also patently not a lie to say that we have been moving against that bill in the media for weeks now or that Starmer's shadow cabinet have done more to expose its weaknesses than those people attempting to paint a second reading protest vote as being anything other than symbolic protest student vote bullshit.

I'm gonna leave this now as I don't think we're going to gain anything from having this out over the internet. Have a good weekend.

Thats not what Im saying at all, but its at the stage that none of them are good. SNP are a shambles in scotland, the Tories are a shambles in the UK and Labour are a shadow of who they use to be.

Its not even voting for the best of the bad bunch, its who do you even vote for that isn't a cunt and will go back on everything they said they would implement before they got in.

Im at the stage none of them are fit for office imo.

Cool yeah, opt about then, let the gammons vote the Tories back in to power again, if we're lucky we'll get Jacob Rees-Mogg as PM and we can replace food banks with work houses.

regardless of what you think of starmer (personally, not much) voting labour is (and has been for some time) the only way out of this tory hellworld.

standards are great and that, but people are fucking dying here.

Never heard of him,Sounds like the man we need to sort out all this mess 🙃.