Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

We time our visits to see aged parents around the monthly ONS tests. The results appear on my medical record (which I can view with the same site that I book my GP appointments with) about 4-5 days after the test. I assume that if it was positive I'd receive a track&trace call sooner than I'd find out by checking a scanned document that was posted to my GP but who knows.

Genuinely hadn't crossed my mind that you could do it on the NHS that way. We've been getting tests before seeing vulnerable friends and family.

That said, we really should have the capacity for anybody to have a test for whatever reason they want by now. Or at least soon. Its a huge failure that we can't. It has been obvious for months that the only way to weather this virus until vaccines are available without utterly fucking the economy is with massive widespread and cheap testing.

Was going to rant here but just saw a buzzard fly overhead, it was magnificent and graceful.
I got flown over by something in Crystal Palace park this morning. No idea whether kite or buzzard (both of which are present here) mostly thought "WTF that's low".

Am I being cynical thinking calling the army in means that serco et al have failed to deliver. Again.

I said it before. Getting an unwarranted test is the logical extension of bog-roll stockpiling.

A large number of the population seem to have the mindset that they don't want to miss out on having a test when they really need one so they'll go and get a test as often as they can when they don't really need one.

f bog-roll stockpiling.

Sooooo.... time to start stockpiling again to stop @greenhell getting any?!

It has been obvious for months that the only way to weather this virus until vaccines are available without utterly fucking the economy is with massive widespread and cheap testing

Although Boris Johnson just resolutely denied this in the HoC:

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1308393352090578945/pu/vid/1280x592/M8LrZ1_f1GtLKC0P.mp4?tag=10

Twato Stupidismo

I think the people you’re referring to are getting a test because they’re worried they might have the virus and don’t want to spread it. I don’t know what it’s got to do with bog roll hoarding.

Everyone should be worried that they might have the virus and don't want to spread it. But that alone doesn't qualify you for a free NHS test. The page I linked to sets out quite clearly the reasons why you should get a free NHS test and, if you don't meet them, that you should pay for a private test.

I don’t know what it’s got to do with bog roll hoarding.

Scarcity of resources (or fear of scarcity of resources) means that people will go out of their way to obtain the resources that they don't strictly need right now.

Reports of panic-buying bog roll = lots of people go out and stockpile bog-roll for fear or running out and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy

Reports of tests not being available when needed = lots of people going out and getting a test when they don't really need it or qualify for it

I'm not sure what result these people are hoping to get from their test, but then people aren't rational when it comes to these kinds of decisions.

Had this discussion the other day. There may well be people using tests to clear themselves before visiting family etc - I have no idea how widespread that really is - but blaming the public is what Hancock et al want us to do, when clearly the government handling of the system (and Dido) is where the blame lies. If they had got a robust T&T system in place and scaled up testing properly over the summer, there wouldn't be the current shitshow.

Flip side is my sister annoyed that colleagues are coming into work (to hospital) with lots of coughs and spluttering, but aren't getting tests because they don't meet the exact criteria of coughing.

you don't usually make jokes that don't have a point to them

Can't help feeling slightly hurt by this :(

I don't think I've ever been on a Swiss train but my understanding was pretty much that they run stereotypically like clockwork. We should probably stop talking about trains in the Covid thread anyway.

I said it before. Getting an unwarranted test is the logical extension of bog-roll stockpiling.

Don't feel slightly hurt! Basically just said you have a sophisicated sense of humour!

Ha, OK I'll take that, thanks :)

I said it before. Getting an unwarranted test is the logical extension of bog-roll stockpiling.

I can see the sentiment behind this statement but I don't see it like that.

Unwarranted testing should have been a goal for the government by this stage. The ideal situation is being able to encourage people to get tested on a whim and have the capacity to do it. Its the only way to make people feel safe going about their lives, earning and spending money, without worrying about killing their grans.

That said, we really should have the capacity for anybody to have a test for whatever reason they want by now.

Absolutely. It was at that point a while back right, during the halcyon days of June/July when everything was getting better and we thought we might be over it I'm fairly sure there was excess capacity. Now people are actually using it everything has fallen over again.

The ideal situation is being able to encourage people to get tested on a whim and have the capacity to do it.

I completely agree, but being fucking useless at actually doing that, and creating a situation where there is a fear of lack of tests, they've completely fucking blown that.

I think blaming the public for being fucking idiots is fine, because largely the public are fucking idiots. Myself and everyone here included.

That said, for something so important, a huge media campaign to educate the public on the circumstances on which they should get a test, and the consequences of abusing the testing system, wouldn't have gone amis.

If its true that the gov have spent £13bn on contracts with Deloitte and Serco for test and trace, thats about £200 for every man, woman and child isn't it? £100bn on moonshot? Seems like a mental amount of money to scale something you already have in place.

but being fucking useless at actually doing that

Presumably building some kind of good-as-infinite testing capacity was achievable here in the UK (from a capability and delivery perspective, ignoring politics) in three months? The govt. just had to make it so?

feels a bit 'everything would be different if everything was different', paraphrasing Dammit.

Sorry I'm a bit of stuck record on that one.

I mean, I get that testing on an enormous scale has a lot of challenges. Even just the moving shit from A to B side of the logistics is complex and sensitive to fuck ups. Just feels that "Operation Moonshot" would have been a lot easier if they had started it in the Spring rather than wait until the 2nd wave was underway to start.

The ideal situation is being able to encourage people to get tested on a whim and have the capacity to do it.

Yes, this. I remember early doors it was reported that S Korea had freely available testing, including drive in ones that people could just rock up to. It's completely obvious that that should be what you should be working towards.

I'm no statistician, but I can easily believe that negative test results, along with some basic information of who took them, has value in modelling in any case (or at least, I don't believe that only positive or symptomatic tests have value).

I assume the Moonshot stuff is rubbish with a snappy title (like 'Star Wars'?). It was reported that the technology doesn't exist to do it, ergo it's not going to happen in anything like a suitable timescale.
Whoever proposed it should have been shut down at that point - at my place of work if I suggested something for an almost immediate delivery that we not only couldn't use (licence / supplier or whatever), but also that didn't exist then that conversation would go no further.

Presumably building some kind of good-as-infinite testing capacity was achievable here in the UK (from a capability and delivery perspective, ignoring politics) in three months? The govt. just had to make it so?

Sorry I'm a bit of stuck record on that one.

I think I estimated that testing capacity increased by 10% to 15% in the last three months, depending on the figures that I used. Do you reckon this represents best efforts?

Sure there are people thinking "oooh free test" but unless the government / statisticians have a shot at what % that is, we don't know how much of a bottleneck it even is.

Literally every system has "abuse" so you need to build a system ready to deal with that. Now if you expect 10% of people getting a test with lying on the form, but it is 30% OK fair enough, you tried and this overshot a calculated guess.

Now maybe they did build this into testing capacity, but I don't know.

Yes, this. I remember early doors it was reported that S Korea had freely available testing, including drive in ones that people could just rock up to.

Willing to bet my hat that precisely no Korean will rock up for a test so they can go and see their uncle at the weekend though. Required capacity is contextual.

Do you reckon this represents best efforts?

I'd just be repeating what I bleated out a few pages back :)