A.S. Gillott owners & appreciation club

Another life for an old Gillott

If you look back at posts 31, 33, 38 etc. in this thread you will see the large blue Gillott which I prepared for my son as a hack bike. Times have moved on and he has discovered an interest in touring - he has a fairly modern Jamis road bike, but for various reasons this is not really suitable for touring.

The old Gillott was not being used for the original purpose, so I've re-converted it back to gears. The kit is not the best possible, but it's something for him to start with. We'll have to see whether he really uses it and then decide on improvements. It will be interesting to see if the gearing proves adequate - I've used 45/32 chainrings and 14 - 24 five speed block. This may sound unsophisticated but I think a reasonably fit young person should be able to climb almost anything with that 35" bottom gear.

I do like the fact that this sixty year old frame is still a desirable basis for a practical machine in 2022.

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Very nice set up love the chainset. I hope it works out for him.
I thoughtt the cotter pin went in from the top, with the drive side crank at 2pm. I notice yours is opposite to my method.

There is a long standing controversy about which way round cotter pins should go. I've come across various theories involving the likelihood of the pins breaking or being forced out of position by the force of pedalling.

I am now pretty well convinced that the only thing that matters is that they have to be opposite ways round (obvs). I say this because I have become aware that the English method is 'crank forward, nut upwards' whereas the continental method is the opposite. This not a brexit issue because both ways work.

The chainset is TA Cyclotouriste rings on a Milremo crank. I favour the TA rings because I've used them most of my cycling life and because they can be combined with any five pin crank. This bike happened to come with steel cranks so it was easier (and cheaper) to keep them. The Milremo crank is not the highest quality, but it works OK - if the bike does get a lot of use in this form I'll look for something better.

In the fifties it was common to combine steel cranks with aluminium rings, even though steel cranks are significantly heavier. This may have been for economy, cotterless ali cranks were expensive, but I think it's more likely that it was mistrust of the reliability of ali. One often used to hear of the pros resisting change because they preferred to stick with what they knew - disc brakes were a recent example.

What a lovely Gillott that! I'm sure your son will enjoy it.

I'm guessing those are 28mm tyres fitted. Is there enough clearance for 32mm with mudguards?

I also really like that luggage rack with the lower pannier level for more stability and the play of rounded and angular tubing design on top. Vintage racks like that must be hard to come by, I'm sure.

Great read as uusual @clubman thanks.
I have fitted a fair few of these cottered cranks now and i always end up having to experiment and play around with them to find the best fit.
Ive come to really appreciate them now and find them very effective and once set up properly very reliable and consistent, its also nice that one tool fits all, ie a hammer.!

Took mine out for a ride this afternoon, Lovely

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Indeed lovely, i particularly like the chainset.

I fitted a headtube/handlebar water bottle cage to my path frame that i took and rode in Scotland, as that is all I had at the time.
I do have a few downtube cages but they were attached to other bikes.
an equivalently aged downtube cage would probably have cost a lot more especially trying to source at short notice, I much prefer the downtube versions as they are much easier to fit and it doesn't make for such a cluttered and busy cockpit.

Cluttered cockpit with modern and essential paraphernalia.
The cage is attached via jubilee clips to the handlebars which hold the cage tight but seem to get in the way of your hands and do not make for a comfortable riding position.

Double cage with the same jubilee attachment method.

I did away with the jubilee clips and held the cage in place using cotton bar tape. Wrapped the cotton with string to hold it in place and then shellacked the lot. I was worried it might fall to bits on the road but its held up well.

I love using the shellac as it makes the tape waterproof and i just find the feel warm and comfortable.
The only down side is that you always end up with the same colour tape once its painted. The bar tape here was a light blue originally.

I guess I should post it here:
Spearpoint from 1951, serial 512512. Original paint.
Wheels - 27 1 1/4 Dunlop Special Lightweights on Normandy LF hubs
Charter Lea 48t & BW bottom bracket
Philips rat trap pedals from another bike
GB levers & GB Hiduminium calipers
Mansfield Bath rd saddle on Stata seat pin
Reynolds COntinental bars on Spearpoint stem
Apex Grand Prix pump
Simplex rear mech and DT lever (both to be replaced)

First outing today since I took it home 2 weeks ago. Washed and degreased, stem and seat pin cleaned and lubricated, pedals fitted and out we went. Everything moves as it should, felt a bit tight on it, so at pit stop in Eton saddle went up and back an inch or so. Front brake OK, rear so so, maybe because cable is stiff, or brake shoes are hard. That front stubby mudguard made a bit of noise on the potholed roads, otherwise it was a nice leisurely 30k or so all-in-all, mostly on flats round mine, better so as that 48 and tight 5 block at rear are not hill friendly.

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That front stubby mudguard made a bit of noise on the potholed roads,

If you look at my post 476 above you can see the mudguards on my son's blue Gillott. These are, I'm pretty sure, the same as yours - Bluemels 'Popular'. It's not a Gillott feature, just a once very common type of mudguard. Close observation will show that front guard has been repaired at the bottom.

The reason your mudguard is noisy is that it lacks the two pairs of stays it was intended to have.

Foreigner 65's post has caused me to look again at my own post, and there is an update that's worth mentioning.

I handed the bike over on a Friday evening and my son said ' That's handy, I'm going on a trip to the Isle of Wight with some friends ...... tomorrow! I said 'don't you think you should road test it and get used to it before doing an ambitious ride?'

He was more confident of my bike assembly skills than I was, and it turned out I hadn't got the derailleur quite right. When the bike came back to me I had to struggle to get it perfect - in the end what seemed to cure it was to change the right hand Milremo crank for a Stronglight (still steel, naturally). The new crank had a smaller gap between the chain ring and the crank, so it effectively moved the chainrings slightly to the right - now everything worked perfectly, what ever I did when test riding I couldn't make it misbehave.

You would have thought that with such a simple system, 5 x 2 with a relatively modern rear mech, every thing would work with no trouble. That's what I thought, but I was wrong.

Incidentally, I went on today's Hounslow club run - Staines to Henley and return, so our paths might well have crossed.

Thanks. Out of interest, which route did you take, along the Jubilee river or via Eton Wick?
And yes, you are right, it must have two pairs of stays, I had that set-up on a Carlton Corsair some time ago.

Brave son you have there, setting off to a long ride just like that, but didn't we all done it in our youth?

Superb bike that, i love the pump. Dunlop rims look to be in good condition too.
I have a set of wheels with alloy rims they are lovely however i can not fit old tyres to them, they keep falling out of the rim so im building up a set of 27.1.1/4 dunlops instead, i like the way they look to be honest and they are not much heavier than the alloys.

Thanks. Yes the rims are in good nick, front especially. Probably because they were covered in grease. Mind you not sure what to use to keep them that way apart polish every so often.

Brave son you have there,

Brave, or foolish? Actually I have a feeling that, unlike us, they didn't ride to Portsmouth.

Our route today from Staines was - Runnymede, Old Windsor then we skirted round the South of Windsor proper and got onto the B3024 near Oakley Green. Then White Waltham, Cold Harbour, Warren Row etc.

I have had this frame repaired it took long enough after getting the toilet roll wedged between the forks and wheel.
The repair looks great Unfortunately Argos havent got the original paint so i have rattle canned it in red. It doesn't look the best. Ive been playing around with parts and have just fitted the alloy mudguards and very scruffy saddle.
I kinda regret requesting gear cable lugs being fitted before the respray as i have also gone for single speed, 19/46 ratio. I need to sort out the front hub as it doesnt match the rear, its a baylis Wiley with straight gauge spokes. The rear is an Airlite small flange with double butted spokes both are laced to Dunlop Special Lightweights.

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It looks like it has a cable stop on rear stay, judging by the that white-ish cable? If not there a band on is an option too. If there you just add a down tube one, I think I have it if you need it?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SHIMANO-CLAMP-CABLE-GUIDE-VINTAGE/dp/B01N4RB1ES

Strangely, I can only see one of your pics (the one at the top with bent forks), but it seems as though Foreigner 65 can see the others.

A couple of points:

Taking your wheel size as 26.5", 46/19 gives you a gear of a tad over 64". Quite low for you, I would have thought.

Although it's not easy to judge from the photo, I'd describe that finish as 'bronze flam'. Given that flams are done with a tinted lacquer over a silver base coat, it's very hard to achieve a perfect match. So options are: put up with a poor match, respray the whole thing, chrome the forks or respray the forks and rear triangle in some 'sympathetic' colour in the hope that it will look intentional ! I would try 'gunmetal' which is just silver with a little black added to it.

BTW, did you see my response to your post 4779 in the old bike thread?

Yeah I’d chrome the forks!

Strangely to me too, I could only see the first one with bent forks too yesterday, but can see three of them today? Perhaps were added afterwards 🙄 Nice colour indeed.

sorry @clubman yes i did see your post i was just procrastinating over my response. Its as usual a thorough and poignant write up. Its also very inspiring and makes me think that we are well due a vintage group ride soon.

ive updated my post above with photos now.
It's crimson flamboyant and very difficult to replicate so I'm just going to leave it for now.
The frame looked stunning when it was delivered from Argos cycles i have since ruined the paint work, i guess that's the trouble with actually using the bike.
My friend rode it to cambridge and destroyed the paint work around the rear dropout. I have chipped the paintwork around the rear brake caliper and in general it has taken a real beating over the last six years. The fork crown has just added insult to injury.
I have added some old tyres and the alloy mudguards which unlike their plastic counterparts are not very forgiving to fit.

Ive taken off the flash gearing mechs and made it fixed and off course you are right the new gearing is low which is great for shorter local journeys.
I'm actually much happier with the look than its previous incarnation.

Yes, I'd be up for a vintage ride this season, and I'll be pleased if you stick to your 46/19 gearing since I'm not going all that fast ATM.

There is a bit of a problem in that we live on opposite sides of London. I'm not super keen on travelling across London before starting a ride, but really it will depend on who else wants to come. Let's see who else is interested.

Your Paintwork

It looks to me that Argos did a really good job with that crimson flam, but flam finishes are inevitably not super durable, so if it's had six years use and still looks half reasonable (forks catastrophe excepted) it's not done too badly.

When I was painting frames I was quite prepared to do flams and metallic finishes, but I would point out that if the customer wanted something durable ( e.g. for a hack or a training bike) then a plain gloss enamel , without lacquer, would look respectable for longer. In the case of 'vintage' frames (pre-war in my book) I would suggest that semi gloss could give a desirable impression of patina.

46/19 noted..
I would be happy to head West, i live very close to Abbeywood so a trip across London on the Elizabeth line would be quite straightforward.

Its nice to know that as a general rule flam paintwork isnt as durable, as it would be easy to assume the chips and damaged paintowrk on my crimson bike was somehow related to a paint issue with Argos cycles

I'm away this coming week - let's try and set a date when I get back.

Sure there is definitely no rush though i was thinking we should wait for it to warm up a bit.

Sadly need to reduce the number in my bike shed, hence this lovely 1951 Gillott https://www.lfgss.com/comments/16911451/ is for sale and I thought only appropriate to offer it to the appreciation group first.

If interested please contact me directly, price I have in mind is very very reasonable. Would entertain frameset offers only too.