EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

Imagine what he'd do if he actually wanted to cause damage.

If he tried to cause damage he'd probably accidentally turn the UK into a glorious utopia.

I will confess to being one of the people who thought he had some sort of secret genius plan. Seems now to be a classic case of Hanlon's Razor - he didn't fail multiple times on purpose, he failed multiple times because he is shit.

Well, don't expect Johnson to resign now, as it would be the honourable thing to do.

Also, based on the last 3 years, if we expect it, it's 100% guaranteed to never happen.

Only a madman would resign at this juncture. winky face

Whatever happens (No Deal Brexit Oct 31st, extension and then Brexit with a deal, extension and then no-deal exit[1], second referendum, confirmatory vote, straight revoke, etc) it's going to leave huge divisions in the country. It wouldn't be unique to the LD's plan of winning an election and revoking A50 based on a manifesto pledge.

I still think it's going to end up with A50 being revoked (after an extension) either due to a confirmatory vote or an outright second referendum, with the most likely appeasement to be a promise of a future referendum in 3-5 years.

Partially kicks the can down the road but at least there can be some proper planning and campaigning for both sides now they now what they are both up against.

1. Note that the current legislation would not prevent this, but then I would expect MPs to push through a similar act to the Benn Act to prevent this.
   

Ah - I see what you mean. But your not talking about the referendum itself, more the feelings it unleashed. The ref can be undone by revoking art 50, or losing a 2nd ref and that will officially put it away (for a while), but the division and distrust will linger for a generation, I agree. IMO remaining is the quicker way for things to heal though.

Unprecedented events continue; "The One Show" bumped to BBC2

More vox pop:

https://twitter.com/Jpiinks/status/1176555483878043649?s=19

Breaking News: Boris is a Fat Shambling Golem of Overconfidence and Underperformance.

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TBH this isn't the worst result. At the end of the day the clock has been run down and nothing in the judgment prevents the govt from proroging parliament again.

The curve ball here is that Parliament has now become the defacto executive. So fuck knows what could happen.

Also can we get a reality check on this whole "advisory" ref. A ref is not binding because only parliament can bind itself. Parliament overwhelmingly voted to trigger A50 - what was it? Like 90%? Parties went into the GE with manifestos saying they'd implement Brexit. Yes you can reassess. Yes you can put it back to the people etc. But inferring some sort of illegitimacy because it was advisory is just fucking double-speak.

Anyone taking bets that Brexit will happen before we get to page 1000 of this thread?

All versions of the Withdrawal Agreement only set up a transitional period until we achieve Brexit climax in a few more years. My money is on 10,000 pages.

Fair point, I’ll keep my money in my pocket!

It’s been a roller coaster so far. One of my favourite bits was one of our home grown commentators invoking his own authority to defend an assertion, a fantastic practical demonstration of chutzpah in a production environment.

I think you may be referring to me.

I'll take that on the chin.

Next time I speak to Lady Hale I will mention that she has diminished my standing in this community and demand satisfaction.

Nope, not you.

TBH this isn't the worst result. At the end of the day the clock has been run down and nothing in the judgment prevents the govt from proroging parliament again.

The legal challenge wasn't meant as an attempt to prevent Parliament from being prorogued again.

It was a challenge to the excessive duration of this specific prorogation at a time when Parliament should be sitting and doing its thing.

Future prorogations attempts will be scrutinised much more closely by Parliament and any attempt to pull any more tricks will probably end up in the courts in the same way but a prorogation for an appropriate period at an appropriate time will go through unchallenged.

Advisory referendum do not have the same levels of scrutiny built in on spending and claims made.

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/watch-lawyer-explain-brexit-vote-would-be-void-for-corruption-if-only-it-was-binding/26/02/

Now this was not know in 2016 but it is now.

https://twitter.com/Jpiinks/status/1176555483878043649

Dredge (and probably answered up thread but didn’t spot it) ..... This (Labour’s proposed deal) is all regarding a WA but also an outline of their ‘vision’.

Gina Miller just socked Odey in his fat gob.

I hope this guy doesn't get a lot of abuse, I think he's brilliant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LIpgh4EZ4o

Excellent, nice to have transcripts behind that video.

Wasn’t answered up thread, and yes- “vision”, in the non-binding PD.

Could also be called a wish-list, and whilst it would have the benefit of warm words from the EU side it would only become a treaty after 6-10 years of negotiations (cf Sir Ivan Rogers).

Yes.

A wish list serves purposes though. Especially for Labour.

Of course, but given the time scales involved it’s likely that Labour would not be in government to finish the negotiations.