EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

The Open University is loads cheaper

It costs the same for an undergraduate degree. Gone are the days of OU being great value for money.

no one really needs a degree to succeed in this world. pretty sure white male privilege still pays my bills and i'm about as educated as a lamp. and it shows.

i guess succeeding is different for different people!

i have standards.

if you don't like them, i have others.

#marx

Aside from everything else, it seems like such a terrible way to teach 18 year olds how to manage cash: borrow a fuckton of it, but don't worry, nothing bad will happen if you don't pay it back.

Had this exact discussion at the weekend (prepping for UCAS for no1 currently).

I disagree - it would prepare them very well for running a large bank.

New entry level CVs start having

"Managed £10Ks, long dated debt positions"

on their previous experience section, straight after the weekend job in Waterstones.

You're pretty bright when you're switched on.

#badoomtish

YOUR. ffs.

What happened to education for the sake of education? Everything is now viewed and valued only through an economic lens and, thats, like, just wrong, man.

Capitalism happened. 100k loans are nothing to sniff at when keeping a roof over yer head for life is in doubt.

I studied in Northern Ireland, now that you mention it: I did see people in England say it became unaffordable as the English uni subsidies from the government got cut back severely.

Tory Magic Money Tree grows another branch:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/28/theresa-may-pledges-galileo-alternative-if-uk-locked-out-of-satnav-system

If I was looking at University now... my chosen course being 7 years instead of 3 (Architecture),

It's 5 years full-time study and if you have any sense you take a year or two out to work and earn money between years 3 and 4. Graduate salaries are around 21k, a bit more in London.

An average salary for an Architect is ~77k, which isn't bad -

Lol. Where'd you find that? This year's surveys show average (median) salary of £38.5k nationally - £42k in London, £36k non-London. Most places you'd need to be a partner/director to be earning that kind of money.

it encourages students to believe themselves customers

At least now that university courses come under Consumer law there is a little more incentive not to completely fabricate the marketing material. Unfortunately the complete (total) marketisation of education means that providers are greatly incentivised to find ever more slippery ways to embellish the truth about what they offer. It's all about making the sale. Although there are dozens of metrics used to assess the quality of the service (including student satisfaction, rate of employment etc), these only seem to have value for more marketing, through ranking and rating.

I am glad I did my degree before 1998, so it was "free" (no loans etc..). If I was doing it now, I'd probably just skip and go heavy on my own learning of technology (or do some guild type thing).

77k was the result of Googling.

I’m somewhat appalled to discover the reality.

You go and work in HK / Dubai / Quatar to earn actual money.

Architecture in the UK doesn’t pay because we don’t build much - as I understand it.

And in doing so don’t repay the student debt because overseas.

£40k is also "not bad" ... it's not appalling by any measure. But yes it's an unfortunate myth that architects make a *lot* of money.

Architecture in the UK doesn’t pay because we don’t build much - as I understand it.

Hmm I'm not sure that's the reason. There is a bit of an oversupply issue, but I think it's as much a question of how much architects are considered to be 'worth' (how much value they add and whether someone else is willing to undercut the fee), as well as the same working culture that afflicts other creative industries (you love it so you'll do it for nothing, right?). Also, you don't legally need an architect for anything, unlike in other countries where you might need one to eg. put a planning application in, or at least sign off on one.

Skilled building trades make quite a bit more but there are obviously downsides.

The student satisfaction system is a farce. You get asked in one of your final years - how satisfied are you? You want to graduate from a university which is rated well and has a well rated course right? So of course, you're 100% satisfied. No skin off your back in any case.

students are asked every year, but only the final year's responses are public, as one of the responses relates to the Uni reacting to previous requests.
that said the NSS is a farce. we usually find our students boycott it, then the results are too small to be reported. win win!

I was happy with the OU, but the tutors did not only help you through exams, a lot of them gave the impression they cared about the field they tutored.

I think that really helps, you get the help and the enthusiasm. Maths tutors in general were good craic and loving the field they taught in, the computing ones were working in IT so they knew how to teach well.

CSB: I dropped off one exam by hand to a maths tutor around 1100 am. He was opened the door...in his blue towel fabric bath robe. He was clearly not expecting a student to hand in their handwritten maths exam. My colleague that gave me a lift and I were chuckling about that for some time, but he took it in good stride.

I only found doing the computing project at a distance very hard, the OU approached it much more accedemically than what our interns did who just build stuff and then had to write a long report, rather than justify it much much more.

When will the madness end

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/aug/29/no-deal-brexit-is-only-alternative-to-chequers-plan-says-lidington

Let the brinkmanship begin!