EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

Quinoa has also increased in popularity since the EU has come into existence. Voting out will not result in it being put in fewer salads.

I know this. I'm just saying that one does not equal the other.

I don't like party politics. Having to chose a group of people who you find least offensive, who will lie to get into power and then not do what featured in the election manifesto is a pointless charade. This is compounded by a civil service who guide the politicians decisions anyway.

It's increased during the same time the EU existed because that's also the same time Microsoft Excel was invented, and computing went from niche to saturation, global communications speed went down to milliseconds for huge volumes of data.

We're witnessing, and living through, not the effect of the EU, but the effect of a technological revolution.

We're seeing changes in industry from manufacturing, to services, to redundancies... not because of the EU, but because technology automates and is crawling up the chain of work from manual to intellectual.

This enormous thing is huge, it's impact is across our lifetime and it is hard to see just like it's hard to sit back and watch an oak tree grow. But it is growing, and it really is now huge and overshadowing everything else.

The EU would be where they are regardless, but the things that people are voting on are mostly the direct impact of a technological revolution. You only have to look at the largest multinationals, the list of the top companies is dominated by companies that mostly did not exist several decades ago. All of whom are so efficient at making cash that they have reserves larger than the GDP of countries. All of whom are so efficient that they pay real rates of barely 1-2% globally, and are happy to just leave cash in banks waiting for the next takeover target (when they become more efficient).

Immigration as the single topic of focus is crazy, the 0.5% influx is smaller than a baby boom generation.

The issue is tax, money, how and why the rich and the multinationals get to not be taxed, how countries make that up by taxing their population more or cutting services... it's the economy. It always has been.

I just think the referendum is a vote on a symptom of something larger than the UK.

And that the root cause isn't who we are currently bombing.

The root cause is what is happening to the money in society, the money in our economy, who has it, and how it should benefit all.

I absolutely do not disagree.

They have also increased outside the EU. So leaving will make little/no difference.

The question (which is impossible to answer with any degree of certainty) is whether they would have increased more/faster had we not been in the EU than they did with us in the EU.

It may make no difference to the fact that there is an increase regardless, but the rate/magnitude of increase is very important.

I never usually vote, it's pointless

Fuck offfffffffff!!!!

Unbilivibil!

Odds on remain shortening rapidly...

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/politics/marketactivity?id=1.118739911&selectionId=9481397

I never usually vote, it's pointless. Yes Minisrer sums up British parliamentary politics.

I'm surprised that it hasn't been raised more that this referendum is a proper chance to have your vote have an impact. The usual 'my vote doesn't matter, this area has a huge xx majority' isn't the case - Every vote counts.

At the same time this technology has a massive impact to make education cheaper, improve trading for everyone, and so on and so forth.

But as the current politicians are looking 50 years back instead of 30 years forward the people that need the improvements of technology never reap any benefits.
[though its always more complex otherwise technological determinism would always work]

But if you see Google roll out easier education in deprived areas and here you get cuts and massive school classes it's like WTF is wrong here. Why at least not try to adapt some of this...

I'm surprised that it hasn't been raised more that this referendum is a proper chance to have your vote have an impact. The usual 'my vote doesn't matter, this area has a huge xx majority' isn't the case - Every vote counts.

I think voter turnout will be vastly different today, and may change the way we vote and the way politicians lobby forever.
Stay or Leave, it's a big day for democracy.

Once they get the driverless cars thing sorted there's another massive group who's only marketable skill has no value any more.

hence why in this case i have voted

Totally. It's so frustrating.

We should, today, be asking the question "What happens when technology has made 90% of the jobs in the country irrelevant?".

We should be embracing the peace, stability, and artistic, creative renaissance that could well await the entire human race. We should usher it in, embrace it and make it happen sooner.

But instead, everyone is getting selfish and fighting to not lose their little thing, their inch of land, their job title, their view.

We should be figuring out how to redistribute the proceeds better, of this wealth machine. How to spread that evenly. How do we get to 100% technological literacy? How could we improve the lives of all in this country and others?

It's the economy. It's the technological revolution. We can't stop that revolution by voting ourselves out of it, but we can definitely lose control of the very few levers that exists that has enough leverage to build a better future.

In. Voted for the first time in my life and I'm 34. For me it was all about keeping peace in Europe and EU seems to be doing that quite well.

Voting is the most profound thing you will ever do with your pathetic meaningless lives. VOTE!

We should, today, be asking the question "What happens when technology has made 90% of the jobs in the country irrelevant?".

The obvious answer should be, until we live in a post scarcity environment, we should be working on the technology that will take care of the other 10%. It'll be infinitely harder and require exponentially more human effort to achieve.

VOTE cos it really matters if you get a mass murderer in or a pig fucking mass murderer in.

The EU tends to be more egalitarian and socialist in scope, if only because most of the member states are.
In any case, that certainly won't change if we leave (under present Conservative managed circumstances) but excesses may be curbed if we remain.

I have a friend who works in the financial sector who reckons that when the Liberal Democrats shared power with the Tories, they restrained greatly what the Tories actually would have implemented had they ruled with a majority.

The EU tends to be more egalitarian and socialist in scope, if only because most of the member states are.

No they're not.

It can go either way: Crowd sourcing, open codes for everything and a base salary for everyone and you'll see volunteering/education and the lot.

Or the ones that have get even more, hold on to the keys of technology like trading algoritms and we cannot catch up, or kill them and get their money to even things out as there's no more gold, it's just numbers on a system.

Probably a mix of the two, but the more we can restrain the have it alls, the better.

Or we can join a virtual country, all ran by computers that negotiates for us. Who do you pay your house rates too then but...who knows...

I understand the selfishness as solidarity is gone. Why give to a charity instead of pot the money in case you lose your job?

Time for an lfgss hard scifi thread perhaps :p

Compared to...?

I can only speak for The Netherlands, not perfect by any means but not on a way to utterly destroy its own health system either.

There's a lurch to the neocon every atm though.

Your vote is anonymous when counted, but there is fraud detection prior to that to prevent duplicates.

That's ok then.
Don't get me wrong, I don't mind being imprisoned or executed as a dissident.
But they are not getting free market research out of me.