Pelizzoli Leggenda, "No more compromises"

2) pelizzoli send me a "draft some kind of cad-drawing" with my changed measurements and also this statement:
"As you will see we don't know the length of the headtube yet, in fact we're working with an old Italian frame building technique, where is way more important to know the front wheel base. At that way the angle and the length of the headtube will be adapted to the rest of the frame to obtain a balanced frame."
To be honest, this bit vague for investing 1.1k euros and I know that it would work with a real CAD drawing.

to be fair marco explained their way of building frames a bit more in detail:
"In regards of the headtube length and angle, probably i wasn't clear enough. Since we do our calculation still with pen and paper and with no software, those data are hard to get. So once all the other tubes of the main triangle are cut to length and mitered, they will be put on a frame jig, and then we can realize what the exact length and angle of head-tube will be. Once known, customer can always have a word in making changes before welding together the frame."

Simple trigonometry, no?

I believe so, as a frame builder wouldn't it be expected for you to know that?

Would have thought so. They sure as hell produce some fantastic frames, so one way or another they must know what they are doing.

Simple trigonometry, no?

Depends on the offsets. It could get a bit complicated, but a napkin calculation still.

i understand and respect their way of building frames but i know the other way (fully cad drawing) which would give me a better feeling, especially when you're ordering a custom frame over the net.

You're doing the right thing. One of my constant issues with bikes (because I'm about your height I reckon) is stupidly long headtubes. If I was going custom, I'd want to be able to check whether it looked like too much of a gate

frame design by aesthetics>>>>>>>>>>>>

So that's why you ride a Lopro....

I just ride frames too small for me and have short headtubes.

What's wrong with gates?

Nothing generally but some just look a bit wrong and I'd definitely like to know how long the HT is before laying down however much on a custom frame.

What's wrong with gates?

I don't like that 'square' look as much. 59-60cm is the sweet spot for me:

But imagine that HT a bit longer and it starts to look odd:

a bit? that's almost double length.

^ That, is a gate... this....

almost but not quite...

^That's quite a gate... isn't it too big for you?

your a gate

Mercian is spot on

sure, you'd be able to use about 8 bottle cages.