eBay, new scam

This has been doing the rounds the past day: http://codenerdz.com/blog/2012/12/03/think-of-selling-on-ebay-using-paypal-think-again/

Simply, there is a scam that results in the seller losing the item and money and the "buyer" obtaining the item for free. The scam relies on Seller Protection and PayPal to dupe the seller into a false sense of security, before then using loopholes in those contracts to reverse the payment after the item has been delivered.

If you sell things on eBay you should take note that Seller Protection is worthless if the buyer reports that the item is not as described (ignoring whether or not it is). There is no obligation for the buyer to return the item, and that the listing is reported opens the door to the chargeback that will return the money to the buyer.

As of today, there is no known work-around. The scam takes advantage of several loopholes in the rules, and PayPal and eBay do not classify this as a scam, they classify it as the seller mis-selling.

The end result of this is that eBay turns out to be no safer a place than something like LFGSS for making such sales... in fact it's probably worse given that if you're selling to a person known to the community on here then protecting their reputation can be enough to keep people on the straight and narrow.

I used to beat the drum about LFGSS being a wild west and buyer and seller beware... and if you wanted protection you could always turn to eBay. It does seem that you should exercise caution wherever you are now, and perhaps use escrow services on eBay if you're going to be selling to people you do not know.

That's fucked!
At least you have an address if you've sold on ebay. Turning up at someone's house would probably be enough to sort it out.

Not if it is a post box, or abroad, or even the other end of the country. This is going to hurt ebay as it will go round the wires pretty sharpish

Surely putting 'sold as is' on your listing would negate all this?

EDIT: Apparently not.

Things have been heading this way for a while. Seller beware.

Agreed. Ebay used to be ok. But way to many dishonest dickheads on there now. IF I sell anything I try and only sell to low value stuff these days.

I am not surprised to hear this, as eBay is the fucking devil.

I have never had and issues selling or buying via LFGSS.

Actually, read down the comments of the article which Velocio linked. An eBay developer gets involved (he reads the hacker-related feeds at eBay). It appears the OP has got himself a full refund and eBay are looking into their processes with relation to this.

Does that mean that they will fix it? Does it mean that they would refund your money if you did not write a well-read blog? Don't know....

I think it's great if you're a buyer, but obviously fucked if you're the seller...

I've only sold two items since I registered on eBay in 1999, it's a ballache...

I sold a Banksy print on eBay - minutes before the auction ended a friend offered to buy said print . I contact winning bid( who already paid via pay pal ) I am sorry but print had been sold. I foolishly arranged a bank transfer instead of PayPal.

The winner then reported me for not sending the print - long story short I had to pay him back again. Even when I produced paper work from my bank tracking the payment to his bank account.

eBay will alway back the buyer.

You did do a bit of dick trading though..... Karma, I think

roughly 50% of all my ebay sales end up with someone trying to scam me.

I get rats not paying, so I pursue for listing fees
ebay.it has an .escrow'fraud on it doing buyers

Miles Brignall wrote a story in the Guardian a year or so ago about selling to people who pay by paypal, collect in person then file for non-delivery.

I've alerted him to this so hopefully it will get national coverage.

I think it's great if you're a buyer, but obviously fucked if you're the seller...

I've only sold two items since I registered on eBay in 1999, it's a ballache...
This

I have completely stopped selling through Le bay. no seller protection at all. its jokes.

I find people are very quick to pretend an item hasn't arrived if you don't use a tracked postage service but for silly little items nobody wants to pay £5 so you're fucked either way.

I have stopped selling. In fact I stopped selling when they stopped me leaving negative feedback for buyers. Never have been stiffed by a buyer, but I knew the crooks would multiply when that happened.

had a few bad experienced selling on ebay , usually involving usa shipping . not sure if they were scams or not but ebay / paypal always backed the buyer . in the most recent case paypal refunded buyer one day after telling me the buyer would not be refunded due to the item not being returned . hes still got the item and got his money back ....

This is making me nostalgic for the good old days of eBay when I could pick up $500 45s for 50c...
Godammit!

I'm canceling my acount. ebay is getting completely ridiculous, now I have to ship before payment is received and wait for my funds until ebay has received message of delivery??

http://pages.ebay.com//sellerinformation/howtosell/acceptingpayments/fundsavailability_lmtdexp.html

trying to explain this to buyers and offering them a way around this 'problem' (me not shipping anything until money is in the bank) is not appreciated:

"For your safety, eBay does not allow the exchange of email addresses in member to member communications"

and they're taking comission on postage cost as well... f*ck that.

Ebay is a pain in the arse

good

I recently sold 17 or so items on ebay all at once. Every single person paid within 3 days, it was a miracle. Half the fuckers haven't left feedback though.

I had someone called sumosumo or something who never paid, not you was it?

nah. I'm ssumo89