Ergogenic aids, racing and training supplements, pills and potions

After reading this article about a way to increase maximum carbohydrate intake during exercise I'm curious about the effects of taking in no protein during a race as in the case of Ironman competitor Chrissie Wellington.

In the example of Chrissie Wellington, the data he showed was from 2007, at which point she was taking 86g carbs/hr; she’s now apparently taking quite a bit more than that, because she’s managed to train her system to tolerate it. Another change Wellington has made is that she now takes just carbs, no protein. Asker’s opinion is that the early studies that found improved performance from taking something like a 4:1 ratio of carbs to protein during exercise were flawed in several ways. His lab has tried to replicate those results and found no benefit from adding protein — so eliminating the protein might make it easier on the gut.

I've spoken to a few people about it and most seem to think that for long stuff, you need to take on some protein. Certainly for multi-day events it makes sense - I'm not sure about 24hr events though.

An alternative to including protein during races was suggested to me - Glutamine.

It's an amino acid, a protein building block and supposedly less likely to interfere with gut function.

This set of US guidelines suggests there may be benefits to its use but no studies have yet been done to prove it one way or the other.
http://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/Fulltext/2009/03000/Nutrition_and_Athletic_Performance.27.aspx

http://johnpostmdsblog.blogspot.com/2012/02/caffeine-2012.html

http://www.canal-insep.fr/eattowinfromsciencetothefieldvo/use-and-abuse-of-dietary-supplements-in-elite-sport/2270

i tend to have no protein during, just a carb juice thing, along with a fat burning supplement to help me access some of my "stored energy", and then i have protein as a post-bike repair fuel. this works pretty well for me, i can certainly see where there coming from with the no protein stance. but i dont think it should be cut-out completely.

I dont eat meat , or fish for that matter. Whilst looking at the Holland and barrett site I found this .

Creatine is possibly the most researched sports nutrition ingredient. It occurs naturally within the body but can also be found in foods such as red meat and fish. Creatine has been shown to support the exerciser's ability to perform high-intensity exercise such as weight training, repeated sprints and speed training for endurance sports. The body adapts more quickly due to the added training stimulus, bringing quicker results when combined with the correct exercise regimes.

So , I was wondering if im perhaps selling myself short as a cyclist by not eating animals ?

Should I be taking this ? does anyone else take this ? Is this the first step to doping ?

Thanks in advance

Tried it years ago (whilst in the middle of 20 years of veggiedom). It's horrible, but it works in limited ways if you chug enough of the stuff. You end up with more water retention in the muscles, and you get a slight improvement in the ability to repeat short MAXIMAL efforts. It has no effect on endurance / aerobic systems.

The thing is, knowing how it's meant to work, whilst taking it you tend to end up doing more very short interval stuff which in itself will be giving you an edge. Having done this kind of thing with and without creatine, I'd still say there's a marginal gain with it, but it's not worth the bloated feeling, the extra water-based mass, or the ritual of downing the disgusting stuff. Waste of money. Can't remember if there's a food-based alternative in a veggie diet which can emulate it to any extent.

For the record, I've been an omnivore again for a couple of years, and nothing much has changed aside from what appears to be a slightly more resilient immune system based on patterns of illness. Performance is still at genetically / technically defined levels.

Unless you're sprinting it's not worth it for the weight gain. Meat is much tastier too.

I'd be wary of taking all your advice on products from the people trying to sell you them

my understanding is that creatine can help reduce recovery time as it speeds protein uptake

creatine di ethyl ester does not have the same water retention effects and does not need the pre loading period to be effective that is required for creatine monohydrate

hence why the monohydrate version is much cheaper

I've used it in the past, mainly years ago when I was doing weight training, with no ill effects. It has previously had a positive effect on maximum effort turbo intervals, even before I turned semi-veggie ( I eat fish ). This may be because I'm trying harder when taking it, as I don't like to think of a supplement going to waste.

As mentioned above, don't use it when doing long rides, as it has no effect there. Also, stay well hydrated otherwise it can be pretty tough on your kidneys! ( good reason to cut back on the booze a bit too )

You should also cycle it in loading phases for best effect, rather than simply taking it all the time ( also not recommended because of strain on kidneys )

You can get it in tablet form to avoid the taste. Like all supplements, it's marginal gains & appears to work better with some people than others. Overall, I'd say it's not as big a waste of money as many other supplements out there.

thanks for the input folks. Think that i will leave it .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0Zu-IJ30M0&feature=youtu.be

So,

If i'm not actually "doping", whats my best way to get some "marginal gains", is there a supplements thread?

Beta-alinine

The ones that have not been banned (yet).

http://www.ausport.gov.au/ais/nutrition/supplements/overview2

Seems to be a good source, which I found via cyclingtips.com.au , which seems to post quite a few seemingly honest articles about these things

Caffeine - stimulant
Sodium Bicarbonate - buffers blood acidosis from accumulation of CO2

Super secret EIS/Team Sky ketone drink - seems to work for them eh.

Just ordered some Beta-Alanine and will go see a nice coffee shop for some beans this weekend.

Sodium bicarbonate is just baking soda right? I have some of that in the cupboard, how on earth would you introduce it to your diet, i can't imagine it being nice on the stomach?

Track sprinters use it and the research suggests its helps in anaerobic levels of activity, but yeah, you'd need to find the dose for you that avoids tummy troubles.

Use caffeine about half an hour before you race. It raises my HR by 4-5bpm for the same RPE, so be aware of that if you use HR when racing.

Beta-Alanine gives me the underskin mealworms.

Bicarb loading definitely works, even for aerobic events with some level of anaerobic contribution so anything up to around 7min or so. Caffeine is the easiest/cheapest/least worrisome on the body to use, 6mg/kg is the optimal dose for pretty much everything

Xav

Enjoy a coffee.

#strategy

Bicarb can work if your digestive tract can take or and/or you don't mind explosive diarrhoea and/or can ride with full shorts........ I seem to rememberer reading that sodium citrate loading works similarly with less GI tract issues, similar idea, improve blood buffering. Best for short event as Xavier has said......

Caffeine is good and legal.

^ Ferrari to Hippy's Armstrong.