Show us your Titanium! - Ti and Stainless bikes

Tommasini? Never heard but a unit like this was responsible for the Christmas roasts the last few years.

That sounds like my dream bike, right there.

Stick with the 10 speed.

That is how the paperwork for a German built 953/Xcr looks:

http://www.norwid.de/angebote/dokumente/17.pdf

anyone care to educate me on why Titanium? Instead of carbon or steel? Why have so many of the bikes in this thread broken and does anyone know much about Van Tuyl?

Specifically about Ti: http://thomas.pattman.net/physics/

And for turther reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yield_(engineering)

Obviously it depends a lot on the build of the frame, but for a given frame weight, I expect a TI frame to be more springy than Steel but last longer as it won't rust. An alu frame would be stiffer than Ti and Steel, but would lose more strength if dented. All for the same frame weight.

IANAEngineer though.

Titanium oxidises (burns) at a lower temperature than its melting point, so you have to ensure it's properly shielded when welding

Discoloration on titanium is not a problem by itself and is more of an indicator that there might be a problem. Because it is known that it happens in a certain sequence: straw, brown, purple, blue, dull salmon pink, grey with oxide flakes. It is part of the inspection criteria.

Good frames should have very little colour on both sides of a weld, but you generally only see the outside of frame welds.

More welding = more strength lost.

so would the extra springyness (technical term) be why ti frames are so prone to breaking? I had a look at yorgos Moots and it was ridiculously flexy at the bb. Is this standard for a ti bike? Thinking about getting a fast tourer (ie a roadbike maybe with a rack or bikepacking style bags and ti was a consideration. More flex can = comfortable but broken bike doesnt...

who are the better respected ti builders?

anyone care to educate me on why Titanium? Instead of carbon or steel?

Why? Because it's shiny and expensive. And subjectively stronger than carbon while being generally lighter than steel. Simples.

Carbon bike hitting Surrey potholes fast gave me the shits so I switched.

I don't think there is enough data to show titanium is more likely to fail than carbon or steel (care to share?) and there's more to it than just chemistry - the materials (layup, gauge, butting) and welding quality for starters..

so would the extra springyness (technical term) be why ti frames are so prone to breaking? I had a look at yorgos Moots and it was ridiculously flexy at the bb. Is this standard for a ti bike? Thinking about getting a fast tourer (ie a roadbike maybe with a rack or bikepacking style bags and ti was a consideration. More flex can = comfortable but broken bike doesnt...

who are the better respected ti builders?

Badly made ti can break due to oxidation during welding. Ti can be repeatedly flexed without fatiguing.

Ti>steel>carbon>aluminium wrt to fatigue life from flexing

Titanium is best if its not welded or manipulated in any way.

Titanium is best if its not welded or manipulated in any way.

I am not aware of bike shaped lumps of titanium running around in the wild. It needs mining, manipulation and welding to make frames.

The failing frames above reminded me of another broken Van Nicholas from a colleague.
The drop outs are made from cheese commercially pure titanium.

Titanium is best if its not welded or manipulated in any way.

CP (commercially pure) titanium is what the first Ti frames of the 70s/80s were made of and they were like blamonge. It's the alloying process that gives the strength. But as has been mentioned you need proper equipment to weld and a very skilled welder (hence the costs) if it's done properly. I suspect US and Czech made bikes stand up better than those made in the Far East due to expertise of welders a lot of it coming from histories in Fighter Jet manufacture. See Morati (Mora Titanium bike company)

Edit I just saw the post above. Unless that bike is really old, I'd not be spending my money with a company that still opts to use CP Ti in the face current knowledge. Shocking.

Train set syndrome for me. Growing up it was just so exotic and I could never afford one. I love the it's colour when naked.

CP (commercially pure) titanium is what early late 70s/80s Ti frames were made of and they were like blamonge. It's the alloying process that gives the strength. But as has been mentioned you need proper equipment to weld and a very skilled welder if it's done properly. Nobody wet the bed here but I suspect US and Czech made bikes stand up better than those made in the Far East due to expertise of welders and a history in Fighter Jet manufacture. See Morati (Mora Titanium bike)

Van Nicholas uses CP for dropouts, BB and head tubes today!
In actual bike frames titanium is nothing special.
http://sheldonbrown.com/rinard/EFBe/frame_fatigue_test.htm

http://www.vannicholas.com/FAQ.aspx

look for CP in "Our Products"

Finally a pic of mine.....nowt special, but 'tis to me! XACD custom frame which I've had a while now....suits me a treat!

new saddle and tape, new/second hand bigboy crank (still with little man cassette) and still haven't got round to sorting the cables.
apart from that I love it

This is my airborne Lancaster.....previously a 26" Ti hardtail, now, a 29er .....gravel bike, I believe the youngsters are calling them nowadays.......it's not a fucking hybrid though, let me just clear that up first.
It's got XTR bits and thompson bits too......and red bits.

As I know I'll never go back to 26" MTB's, this transformation has ensured it's survival in my stable!
It's a lovely ride.....fast, nimble and comfortable over distance.

Excuse shit iphone snap.......I have no photography skills anyway.

Whilst we're talking MTBs

26" aint dead

So tempting... http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/FRPXTIPRO/planet-x-ti-pro-road-frame

It is unfinished, so forgive the mismatched wheels (I'm currently lacing another Atlanta 96 rim to a more modern hub), but here's my Litespeed with some Dura-Ace and such. The frame is from about 1991, and did a good few Ironman races before I ended up with it.

fixed, designed for a belt drive
was finished once, but now it is still in the process
thinking to add an option of a hybrid

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My Omega...

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The time came to get mudguards for the winter bike. I was hoping to do it discreetly and neatly. PDW to the rescue. Quite pleased with them though clearance is a little tight with 25mm Veloflex on 23mm Archetypes (doesn't bother me as pretty soon when I can expect bad weather regularly I'll switch to my standard winter tyre of choice, Pro4 Grips in 23mm). Couple of times the rubber flaps got caught and were pulled up between the guard and tyre. Not front and rear flaps are half melted away with holes in them. Going to have to find a solution to that.

I've been riding this for the past few months. Signature custom titanium with SRAM Apex. First owner of the frame told me that the geometry was a copy of an old Pinarello with a slightly longer head tube. Few more pictures in Flickr and specs in Pedalroom.