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Since Im the OP Ill add to my experience here, my times have improved with added gym strength. Havent got a chance to use the watt bike since january so cant give any data. Race season started this week, I feel faster and fitter. My legs dont tire the same way, probably because most of my bike training is with clipless pedals now.
first sprint event in my league is in 2 weeks, hoping to impress my peers -
Gotta admit that I also now have access to wattbikes.
And.
May do a bit.
On one.Putting your legs behind your neck seems to keep the core working.
In relation to this lactate thing.
Can anyone say about blood lactate? Will soon have access to this test as well.
Presently, the only comparison I have is when maxing out on rollers or track- and feeling that distinctly sickly cold rush when you know there's something odd going on inside.
Gratefully j -
Imo core isolation is a waste of time
Different people require specificity, there were and are several high level track sprinters (including GB national squad) that do or did isolated core exercises as part of their gym work.
I don't think 'opinion' is particularly relevant in this context, Colm, what you believe to work for you isn't necessarily good general advice. -
Different people require specificity, there were and are several high level track sprinters (including GB national squad) that do or did isolated core exercises as part of their gym work.
I don't think 'opinion' is particularly relevant in this context, Colm, what you believe to work for you isn't necessarily good general advice.ok Ill put it like this, if you are doing the 3 exercises I listed then there is no need for core isolation. If you are a pursuiter and dont do olympic press or heavy squats then core isolation would be beneficial
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Imo core isolation is a waste of time, olympic press,deadlfits,squat, thats all good core work. 80kg by 10 sounds like a shoulder machine press.
No, I only use the machine for leg press
Free weights for everything else, good to get my muscle balance strong50/50 power distrubition between left and right seems odd, isnt there normally a dominant side?
Well from rowing training on ergs its all balanced stuff. Thats the major leg training I have done so I guess thats why
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I can explain it but that wouldnt matter to you.
maybe later if someone else says what I said was wrong!It's "wrong" because you are unable to explain why it's not arbitrary. Perhaps you could answer my original question and explain on what basis you make such statements and what evidence exists to back them up?
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There are a lot of very highly qualified and experienced coaches prescribing core exercises (in additon to back squats and deadlifts) to a lot of very successful riders. But we are now going to accept that they are all misguided just because DFP and Colm off the Internet said so but had nothing other than personal opinion to back it up?
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Ill never live that homeopathy episode down. It began because I knew people who had seen homeopathic doctors in south asia, who received treatments of medications in special bottles a lot of which is imported from Germany. They all differentiated it to herbal or ayurvedic, claiming it worked loads better. In the end I managed to inspect some of these such medications. And it turned out they were Herbal medicine after all. Just very good quality herbal medicine. It gets dispensed by Homeopathic practioners, and everyone in places like Bangladesh and India knows it as homeopathic medicine. When in fact it isnt.
Well that is the explanation of that episode.
In regards to specific 'core' training. Me and Colm have so far been assuming that RPM means abdominal work, most specifically anterior abdominal work. Now, this stuff really is covered multiple fold by any of the traditional compound exercises. Anything from push ups to squats. For someone specifically looking to increase their standing press, they may look into isolation exercises for their triceps, abs and such to help boost their press. But even they would have to fit them in very carefully, as any additional ab fatigue only removes opportunity to do more valuable exercises, like the press itself, bench press, deadlifts etc.
Now for someone using an exercise like the standing press to help their cycling, they should focus on riding their bike and use their high value strength exercise (the press) when they have time. The riding gets priority, the high value compound strength exercises come after.
Isolation comes so far behind/low on the priority list that it isnt even worth thinking about. They are useful in the event of injury or to address specific problems of the individual, like imbalances etc. Which are very unsual, unlikely and most often corrected by the compound exercises anyway. And even with isolation work, for a cyclist it would be sooner appropriate for them to do these for things below the waist. Glutes, quads, calves etc. Not abs, because abs are worked so immensely hard with pressing, squatting and deadlifting anyway plus as already mentioned, ab isolation work removes opportunity to do more valuable things.
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In regards to specific 'core' training. Me and Colm have so far been assuming that RPM means abdominal work, most specifically anterior abdominal work.
I actually asked V-L what he was doing for "back and core". Especially as he didnt list back squat or deadlift in his session. This is when you mentioned core exercises were unnecessary, regardless of whatever assumptions you have made, this is a rather sweeping statement to make.
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Shoulder Press:
80kg x 10 reps
85 x 10
90 x 10
then front shoulder press at
70 x 10
75 x 10
80 x 10
Then leg press at
110 x 10
115 x 10
120 x 10Thats the circuit training that we are doing really, legs one day for cycling and arms the other for rugby
Those are pretty mental numbers. Are those on a machine?
How does it compare to OHP?
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I think 99% of the time in internet disputes, all parties actually agree but dont realise it. I am sure in real life we would be on the same wavelength. I probably have a little more experience in gyms , teaching people to lift weights for sports/pastimes which are not cycling. RPM actually has experience with cyclists and track coaching right? I trust you to know what your on about in regards to riding, and perhaps it would be fair to respect that I might know what I am on about in regards to general S & C, I try not to overstep my boundaries in terms of experience/knowledge (although I may have done in the past) . Just because someone in Team GB once did some situps doesn't mean they are the most effective use of training time/recovery for everyone riding track. I can say that comfortably, even though I dont ride track. Because it is basic common sense.
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DFP
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Squats and deadlift numbers, corelationship with max watt output
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Why? Sorry mate, your understanding of training principles in general seems to be so poor that whatever I said you would most likely struggle to understand.
As I neither have the time nor the inclination to educate you from the ground up to the required level, I will just leave it there.