Ultracycling

But that's part of racing no? The only argument against drafting that I can appreciate is that It opens the door for large chain gangs to ride as an organised bunch. But if someone has caught you up and is drafting from you then yeah it sucks, but then force them to the front or drop them!

As mentioned above, I don't race these events so my opinion is pretty much irrelevant.

But that's part of racing no?

Not this kind of racing, no. No more than it's a part of racing if you're taking part in a time trial.

But that's part of racing no

No. I don't see why I have to keep saying this. These are "no drafting" events.

If I decide to get into a car and drive to the finish, I've failed at adhering to the rules and will be DQ'd. Same goes for drafting.

Exactly.

If you catch someone, ride around them and pass them quickly.
If you're passed, drop back to let them carry on.

Shit, ride side to side for 10min for a chin wag, it's not drafting. Just don't do it for 2100km and then 'win'.

I think he means racing more generally be it running, swimming, cycling etc.

I’ll abide by it but I’ve never liked no drafting rules as I’d agree it’s part of “racing”.

No. I don't see why I have to keep saying this. These are "no drafting" events.

Yes I appreciate that and get how it would mean a DQ. I'm not questioning why someone would be disqualified for breaking the rules.

I think my query was why drafting is banned and the only reasonable reason I could find is that allowing it opens up the possibility of organised chain gangs. Banning it is the easiest way to keep things 'fair'.

Anyway that's my risible contribution to ultra cycling done with. I'll happily stick to self supported touring.

Drafting isn't allowed in triathlon events. Does that bother you as well?
Ultraracing is "who can get the fastest from point A to B without help." Or one long, unsupported time trial. Has little to do with the racing you see on TV.

It's a test of what you, as an individual can do, not what you and several other

Solo and unsupported. Theres honour in that.

Some triathlon events, but yeah I don’t like the concept in that either.

Thing is it’s never just you.

You need to expand...

Coaches, family, sponsors.

Should we all build our own frames, for the honour ;-)

Should we all build our own frames, for the honour ;-)

I am for my Ultracycling debut this summer.

On a more serious note, the point is where you draw the line. Where you draw the line is to an extent arbitrary. But the whole point about drawing the line is that once it's there, you either stick to it, or you don't take part, or you cheat. If you don't want to comply with a no-drafting rule, then there are lots of races where drafting is allowed. Do one of them instead. If you sign up to an event with a set of rules, which you know about beforehand, I don't think it's too much to expect people to stick to them. If you think the rules are silly, don't do the event.

There is also another option, the event changes it’s rules.
Like I said before I’ll happily follow the rules doesn’t mean I agree with them all.

How’s the frame building going? Which race did you enter in the end?

Like I said before I’ll happily follow the rules doesn’t mean I agree with them all.

Exactly

I wasn't condoning people draft and flaunt the rules. Just querieing the rationale for banning it.

Drafting is such a big deal in cycling that a draft-legal ultra would be a very different event and impossible to organise from a safety or logistics point of view.

PBP is basically a draft-legal ultra. What happens is that people set off at high speed to stay in the group. All the groups go like this but the front group, which is the real race, is more extreme. I haven't ridden in the front group but people who have say it is the most elbows-out competitive event they have ever ridden in. People come off and break bones, or scrape skin and get back on again. The only thing that matters is holding your wheel as, if you lose it, you are not going to get it back again. The group tends to gradually slim down as people can't take the pace, then there is a break a few km out, or even a sprint for the line, from those who have stayed together for the distance. Last time was very unusual as Bjorn managed to break 700km out and stay away. Finally the route has been selected and risk-assessed for safety.

Imagine the TCR with those rules. Everyone starts off and fights to get into the front group. If you miss it, your 2-week race is over in the first 10 minutes. Let's say 5o get into it and the rest plod along behind in 1s, 2s and 3s. PBP has a race car and motorbike riders (plus French drivers who respect the event and give way to it). They ride ahead and warn drivers to keep clear of the bunch. TCR would not have those so there would be conflicts with oncoming cars and also following cars trying to overtake.

The group gets to a junction. You see the guys ahead go one way but your route is the other way. What do you do? Follow the wheel of course! No way your slightly better route could make up for losing the group. The guy whose route it is rotates off, so now you are in the front but you don't know the route, so you have to just guess and see if the others follow you or not.

After a few hours, the group agrees that they will stop at town x for 5 minutes. There is no organised control like PBP so you hit a supermarket. You are stuck in the slow queue behind a housewife doing her weekly shop. Some guys got served straight away. Are they going to wait?

And so on...

It would be such a different event and, totally unsafe and probably illegal in many countries, to have a big group bowling along without any organisation behind it. You might as well say why can't I pick up the ball in soccer when it is ok in rugby - it would be that different!

Thanks for that insight, appreciate the nuance of it and the safety issues.

The issues you highlight about routes diverging and people stopping at different times are precisely why it would be interesting with drafting in my opinion. It adds that extra layer of complexity and decision making. As you say ,do you back your route over someone else? Would you all sleep / stop at the same time etc? Would you all slow down to try and force free loaders to take a turn etc? It would make the race more interesting from a dot watching perspective as it would keep a far higher percentage of riders in with the chance of the win. Rather than a couple of solo riders competing for the win and the rest of the field racing for the top 10.

Anyway It's banned in most races so them's the rules. Thanks everyone chipping in with insight and experience, very interesting to see your perspectives. Apologies if it touched a nerve with anyone and if I'm way out of touch. Cheers all

If you don't like or can't abide by the rules don't enter the race.

Triathlon has no drafting rules, time trials, swimmers are in their own lanes, it's not a strange concept.

None of them providing assistance during the race.

You need to watch Rocky IV a few more times.

Thanks for taking the time to explain.

it would keep a far higher percentage of riders in with the chance of the win

No it wouldn't. How many riders do you think could actually sit on James, Bjorn, Matt's wheel?

There are some draft legal 'ultras' but they tend to be 24hrs and on race tracks, Revolve and some of the US stuff, for example.

Now that we've covered that.
How about exercises, specifically to stop my neck turning to jelly....

That was kind of my original point in this whole thing, that if you're strong enough you'll drop anyone trying to hang on so drafting is fine (especially on an event like TCR with multiple routes and such a long duration).

You then mentioned the 30% less effort stat which implied lots of 'lesser' riders would be able to hang in for longer...

Anyway, I better do some work. And this has all got largely pointless. Good luck to everyone racing any ultras this year, be it your first or one of many.