Tourney: WHBPC 2011: Seattle 08-11.09.2011

any chance the mods could move some of this discussion into the tactics and training forum? I've been mad busy last few days and havent had a chance to see these videos and read comments on them but would like to come back to them in the next few days.

What happened to Nick Vaughn, he was great to watch at last years worlds. Didn't even hear what team he was on this year.

he didn't come to worlds, or NA's I think. Disagreed with some elements of the organisation it seems. Chris roberts was there but not playing either...

There seems a few moments, not just in this video, where it feels like rules were bent a little against "europe" to give the US/Canada guys that extra advantage. i can't help think that they weren't expecting such a challenge from Europe and at times were totally out played...eg. Guardians against CMD looked lost on court.

Agree, this was happening already in Berlin, but on a smaller scale and not in the finals.

London need to start playing dirtier, we're getting left behind (or were never in front).

Disagree.

i can't help think that [the North Americans] weren't expecting such a challenge from Europe and at times were totally out played...eg. Guardians against CMD looked lost on court.

I was shocked by Guardians performance in that game too. I think EU polo is way more technical.

More skill, less aggression - CMD *et al *have shown that it can work. Don't sink to the level of others, rise above.

London need to start playing dirtier, we're getting left behind (or were never in front).

I genuinely don't know if this is a joke or not.

At the end of the day, when the other guy is bigger you should stay away from him.

The game was pretty dirty but I would say the majority of the play was 'tough' not 'dirty'. Those guys are just tough bastards, and they are all huge.

Not much of the 'dirty' play is even against the rules. And will vs rory against the boards, what do you expect is going to happen! Will does his fair share of shoulders and elbows as well, they just aren't quite so effective due to his size.

There is some reprehensible stuff in that video, without a doubt, but that's the top level of this sport. And not many people at that level complain about it.

Honestly you think that to operate at the top level of this sport you need to be a big tough man and throw your weight around?

any chance the mods could move some of this discussion into the tactics and training forum?

Start a thread there about whatever you want to talk about.

I was joking.

Check 14:56 in Do's finals edit (Alex would have been in a perfect 1-2 situation on goal but instead goes for some pointless block/bit of argy bargy that makes him fail to receive the pass): the ball should be everyone's priority in polo, then your team mates, the the opposing team, or something.

Dirty play is for dicks, but if a ref doesn't call anything you're left with two options: walk off in disgust or play that kind of polo, I'd choose number two then bitch about it later.

More skill, less aggression - CMD *et al *have shown that it can work. Don't sink to the level of others, rise above.

I feel bad for CMD because they were faster and more skilful than CC but still lost out... In a years time I wouldn't be surprised if Europe runs rings around NA... The game seems to be developing at a much faster rate on this side of the Atlantic...
#imho

I thought so, the brackets threw me off!

the ball should be everyone's priority in polo, then your team mates, the the opposing team.

Surely scoring goals, and not conceding should be the priority.

Maybe there is more than one way to skin a cat, and the tough play (if allowed) is one of those.

Love how in the Final of the WHBPC it's possible to tap back into the game without a mallet. Genius!

Paraphrasing Brian Clough but fuck your medals if they weren't won fairly.

Nothing has ever been won fairly in any sport. I have never seen a clean game, of anything. Sport is not fair, and none of us are clean/fair players.

Honestly you think that to operate at the top level of this sport you need to be a big tough man and throw your weight around?

No, that's not what I said. I said that's how it is right now, I didn't mention how I think the sport should be.

Nothing has ever been won fairly in any sport. I have never seen a clean game, of anything. Sport is not fair, and none of us are clean/fair players.

wtf?!

Everyone is trying to give their personal analysis of the games, but they are ignoring the rules.

The world champs brings together players from scenes all over the world, of course there will be different levels of physicality and contact. They don't know any better, and neither do we. We can sit here preaching the clean/fair game, and they can preach the tough/checking game, and we are both right. As both games fall within the ruleset.

If you want the game to be cleaner and fairer then the rule set needs to be totally overhauled, which I am in favour of. But don't expect NA to subscribe to it.

wtf?!

Sorry I meant everyone but Josh. Josh is the only clean/fair player.

^ Japanese are..

I'd have called each one of them (if seen and if no advantage) and reset the game, yes this makes for bad polo... but so does watching players push each other over in a dabbing war (extreme, but just trying to get the point across).

Calling fouls and stopping play makes for good polo.

If you want the game to be cleaner and fairer then the rule set needs to be totally overhauled

If the ref had called the shoves/t-bones/etc as written in the NAH ruleset then this would have been a "clean" final in my opinion.

Calling fouls and stopping play makes for good polo.

I guess I should have written "bad polo" (as people hate it when the game's stopped: "you're ruining the flow", tsk).

let me try that again:

Nothing has ever been won fairly in any sport. I have never seen a clean game, of anything.

wtf?!

Many of the fouls I noticed are covered by the rules - tboning, shoving, pushing. At least covered by the discretionary power to bin someone for repeated reckless dickish behaviour resulting in fouls.

Weren't a lot of these rules invented by the Americans ? That's how Australia got a ruleset with actual fouls in it - because Lewis brought back the bench minor rules.

It's up to refs to enforce them.

Don't completely absolve the players: playing that way is a choice.

sorry, a late post-er again. what jono said.

Don't completely absolve the players: playing that way is a choice.

totally, James! couldn't agree more. I just meant as a preventative type thing, ya know. The first foul of that game, if punished adequately, could have gone a long way to cleaning up the final.

The world champs brings together players from scenes all over the world, of course there will be different levels of physicality and contact. They don't know any better, and neither do we. We can sit here preaching the clean/fair game, and they can preach the tough/checking game, and we are both right. As both games fall within the ruleset.

If you want the game to be cleaner and fairer then the rule set needs to be totally overhauled, which I am in favour of. But don't expect NA to subscribe to it.

I don't think the rules need to be overhauled, necessarily, but it's obvious that different refs, and different styles of reffing, are going to lead to different styles of play. The LO finals were pretty clean from my recollection, and without wishing to blow my own trumpet, I think that had a lot to do with the fact that I am known to be a 'strict' ref. Therefore the players modified their play to my perceived style of reffing, and I only made one call for a foul across the 2 games.

If N American refs don't call a lot of fouls, or they interpret the rules in a different way, it's obvious that the players will adapt their play to this style of reffing.

Looking at football, even though most top European league games are now televised across the continent, there is still a significant difference in the level of contact which is typically permitted in English Prem League games than in, say, French Ligue 1 games. Players that have come across from Ligue 1 or Serie A (in which permitted contact is significantly less than Prem League) adapt to Prem League 'standards', and are often found to be enthusiastically adopting the Prem League attitudes to permitted contact.