Religion. Discuss ( or should that be argue )

I actually prayed to a higher power in May 2008. I'm not sure why. I don't believe there is one but i did it anyway. And John Terry fell on his arse.

Luckily in the John Terry case there is actual photographic evidence.

problem Dawkins?

Help! - i think theoryswine was joking. and i liked your calling out the misuse of 'therefore' very much!

That's an argument against one very specific form of organised religion though, it's not an argument against religiousness or spirituality in general.

Which are also total bullshit but I'll leave that argument to the pros.

Religion of all denominations murders, rapes, kills, tortures, oppresses and scars. It ruins everything, no good has ever or will ever come from it. I can't believe people still believe in this shit in 2011.

You cant explain that...

O'Rly?

Interesting points, but I think you might have misunderstood mine.

Fundamentally (imo) most religions primarily deal with man’s interaction with God and with each other. Ignoring the parts of religion that deal with human interaction, the best way to form and conduct a society, etc. *is *worth looking at.

…one step away from invoking Godwin's law…
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Ok, joking aside, hopefully you took my point that antiquity is no measure of validity……

I am not saying in itself that the age of a belief makes it by default valid and applicable. However, it does make it worth looking at, think about movements like The Enlightenment. Dismissing old disciplines out of hand (which I think far too many people do), is not a wise choice.

Can you say why you feel 'they' have a lot of very valid and relevant points ?

Firstly, IMO human nature is human nature, people change very little.

Off the top of my head I can’t think of many points, but for e.g. part of the purpose of Ramadan is to spend time focusing on God and your family avoiding other distractions. So remove the God bit if you want and you have a good point. People will obviously counter this (as they do with xmas) by saying “oh but why do you need religion to tell you to do this, surely you can do this yourself…”

Yes of course you can. However, people usually don’t. People generally work best to routine. Having the routine of a set period of time when you do focus on loved ones.

… more Godwin's law….

Just to deal with this. How much of Mein Kampf have you read?

Is it based on thousands of years of studying and teaching? IMO it is not. It follows a modern anti-Semitic line that was born out of science, as opposed to traditional anti-Semitism that stems from religion.

Also I don’t think anyone would argue that all of Hitler’s ideas were useless. There were some good ones, it’s just his ideas and their application were routed in a bad doctrine.

Ah! But how is that any different to religion? Well, to my knowledge most religions *start *with the premise of love. Hitler’s *started *with the premise of the need for strength and dominance. I think there is difference.

And yes, if you want to study it as a how-to-guide on fascism, indoctrination or marketing, it would be very useful. Hitler was hardly a muppet, was he.

It follows a modern anti-Semitic line that was born out of science, as opposed to traditional anti-Semitism that stems from religion.

i like traditional religious anti-semetism. but i like hitler's pseudo scientific modern anti-semetism. but which is better?

Did Hugo just say Hitler "had a point"?

points.

"Well, to my knowledge most religions start with the premise of love"

Actually they start with the premise of control and fear.

And I would say religious Anti-S wins.

2 reasons;

1) They killed Jesus, you can't ague with that; and
2) It wins on age.

There is no Jesus, only Zuul.

^^^ I disagree. I think they are about loving God and loving each other.

I agree that they way the majority of religious institutions excersise power and control is via control and fear (I would also add guilt, and the removal of guilt). But that is not the same.

^^^ I disagree. I think they are about loving God and loving each other.

I agree that they way the majority of religious institutions excersise power and control is via control and fear (I would also add guilt, and the removal of guilt). But that is not the same.

The sad thing is that, since there is no God, so, so many people have been living a lie.

Tynan would have enjoyed this thread.
Or should that be TYNAN!

LFGSS debate makes me want to execute myself.

IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THE FORUM CONSENSUS YOUR VIEWS WILL BE DISCREDITED.

Willy-waving/bum-sniffing party is that way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

in

Can some translate SP's post? Not sure I get it.

We're going out in Vauxhall.

Can some translate SP's post? Not sure I get it.

LFGSS debate makes me want to execute myself.

IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THE FORUM CONSENSUS YOUR VIEWS WILL BE DISCREDITED.

Willy-waving/bum-sniffing party is that way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I think he is saying he doesn't like the way debates on the forum are carried out/end up. This is because if you deviate from the common consensus you get gunned.

I guess the willy-waving, means people showing off and the bum-sniffing refers to people sucking up to each other.