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• #27
in other words, little and often, to answer your question...
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• #28
Spybot speaks sense. Don't get hung up on whether or not you are making full eye contact; the very act of turning your head has an effect. Though if you find it impossible to turn your head (or body) to make eye contact when you really want or need to then it is something to practice; often taking one hand off the bars and dropping your shoulder will help. You should be looking over your shoulder often; quick glances, longer looks and stares where appropriate. Eye contact is remarkably effective, for example, at getting drivers on side roads to stop at or before the give-way line rather than inching forward in to your path.
And eye contact is not just for drivers; it can stop pedestrians and other cyclists in their tracks too. -
• #29
Kurwa, tramwaje! I don't get the trams even in the car - it's always bit suicidal.
Musisz wykonac zdecydowany manewr obserwujac ruch wokol Ciebie. Jesli jestes ignorowany, zrezygnuj.
Definitely you have to fill up the space and be assertive. If I fail to slow down the traffic around me, sometimes I give up and either try to find different way or zebra crossing.
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• #30
I find that a head movement to the rear plus a very slight movement is often enough to get drivers to yield. I have even had full eye contact interpreted as aggression by an anonymous white van driver!
Although I haven't had an issue with it, there is a fine for using zebra crossing on your bike but as so many people break the rules I think the police turn a blind eye to it. I prefer the road though as the zebra crossings take so much time - if I go on the road I can save up to 15 minutes on my commute, mostly due to the fact that nobody stops at zebras here. -
• #31
Thanks for the clarification. It seems in regards to assertive riding, the importance of having eye contact always come up on websites, forums, print etc.
I do take back glances very often, and of course, hold back looks when attempting to move out, all thanks to cbt training years ago (thumb up).
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• #32
I get the theory about having eye contact, but find it difficult to do so in practice (moving traffic).
When are you suppose to attempt to get eye contact? When attempting to do maneuvers such as moving out to pass parked cars, junctions etc. or each and every time you take backward glances?
When is it there (if ever) no point in making eye contact when driving alongside moving traffic?
Great point.
Off the top of my head it is most important whilst moving and wanting to switch lanes. You don't want to try and switch lanes in moving traffic without knowing for sure if the vehicle behind isn't about to go speeding into the space that your attempting to get into- it is the surest way of knowing whether you have been given way OR NOT. Most other look backs are just for clarification as to what is there.
I imagine multi lane roads, navigation on larger roundabouts **AND **right turns are heavily reliant on proper eye contact.If this doesn't make sense I can clarify it better.
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• #33
there is another technique to turn off multi lane roads that hasnt yet been mentioned.
Say for example theres a three laner youre travellling on, you need to go right at an upcoming roundabout or T.
Watching behind you for a break in traffic stream (light sequence, whatever)
you can safely get across all three lanes way ahead of the junction, staying on the far right of the road, then glancing back but keeping your place there, when traffic catches you up youre effectively inviting them to pass as positioning is obvious, then when you reach junction take the lane again and continue. -
• #34
One more thing which DJ brought up after his cycling training - if you let go of the handlebar on the side you want to scan, it will give you more room to turn your head around, which is important when joining in the moving traffic or making a rapid turn/u-turn.
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• #35
That is a useful technique; just be sure too look ahead as well as you can first; hitting a pothole or bump when you only have one hand on the bars can be very messy.
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• #36
I was thinking about techniques for cycling in traffic this morning as I was cycling along traffic free country roads and thought the following might be useful:
I find that a lot of vehicles brake very late, and threfore have to brake sharply. Look ahead a couple of cars, when the a car ahead brakes that effect will ripple through the queue, so you can ease off and give yourself more braking space, or begin braking sooner.
Use the vehicles around you to your advantage. Look in mirrors, especially if you can't see the driver, as you can often see them in the mirror. If you can see them you can see if they have checked in the mirror or if they are looking somewhere else like towards a side road they might turn into.
This can also let you see manoeuvres before the vehicle performs them. If you see a hand move on the steering wheel it could mean a turn is coming up (e.g. right hand going over to left side of wheel to spin wheel to the right).Watch the front wheel. You'll see it turn before you see the car turn. You can also see where a car in a side street is intending to go by the way their wheels are turned. This is also useful for seeing when a car is pulling away.
Use the windows. Look through other vehicles to watch ahead for brake lights/indicators coming on, you'll be able to anticipate the traffic slowing and won't have to brake sharply.
Obviously you can't look everywhere all at once, but you can try ;)
I should point out I have not had cycle training, nor am I a cycle trainer so please say if the above advice is frowned upon, and I'll edit. -
• #37
Nice one Andy, what you have posted demonstrates several ways that your own road awareness has helped you in advance.
this one
"Use the windows. Look through other vehicles to watch ahead for brake lights/indicators coming on, you'll be able to anticipate the traffic slowing and won't have to brake sharply"is the only bit that is questionable against National Standards, we teach that you often cant see through vehicles,
(especially with regard to doors opening) and therefore are better to adapt youre speed to the whole vehicle your travelling next to and its position and place in the traffic stream.As an addition for country roads,
when riding along wherever there happens to be blind bends or dips, ask yourself "should any driver overtake another vehicle (i.e you) on this section of road", if the answer is "no", then that section is somewhere you can be taking the lane. This prohibits that horrible and dangerous fast acceleration then braking as oncoming traffic appears. Once visibility clears again, it is likely that vehicles can again get up to speed, so let them past.
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• #38
I didn't mean you should always look through the windows, but I sometimes find it helpful to do so. Obviously it's not something you should rely on being able to do as you can't see through all vehicles.
As an addition for country roads,
when riding along wherever there happens to be blind bends or dips, ask yourself "should any driver overtake another vehicle (i.e you) on this section of road", if the answer is "no", then that section is somewhere you can be taking the lane. This prohibits that horrible and dangerous fast acceleration then braking as oncoming traffic appears. Once visibility clears again, it is likely that vehicles can again get up to speed, so let them past.
Yeah I do this too, I also take the lane when going down steep hills. I figure if I'm doing 30-40mph I want some space! -
• #39
Arducius; thanks for that. Looking at a vehicle's wheels is a useful tip and one that a lot more motor bikers than cyclists seem to know.
I think we all develop our own little techiniques, not all of which are easy to describe or teach. One of the reasons experienced cyclists gain something from training is that they can be reassured that some of their techniques are sound and challenged on those that might not be so good.
I have a way of dealing with buses that seems counter-intuitive but works well. If I am alongside the bus and it signals to pull out, or even starts to move out, I will move closer to the bus. The driver has a good view down the side of the bus and by moving in you make it impossible for the driver to pull out any more till you have gone past. I think if you move away from the bus, which seems the 'safe' manouevre, you actually encourage them to keep taking up the space you are in and forcing you out further in to the road. But you need to keep in mind that if getting closer does not stop them then you will need to move out parallel to them so it is vital to have looked over your shoulder to see what is behind you. -
• #40
weave about all over the road make car drivers intentionally nervous make those feet hover over the brake pedals then smile and say have a nice day :)
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• #41
This is great! Cheers guys! Keep em coming, please!
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• #42
Arducius; thanks for that. Looking at a vehicle's wheels is a useful tip and one that a lot more motor bikers than cyclists seem to know.
I think we all develop our own little techiniques, not all of which are easy to describe or teach. One of the reasons experienced cyclists gain something from training is that they can be reassured that some of their techniques are sound and challenged on those that might not be so good.
I have a way of dealing with buses that seems counter-intuitive but works well. If I am alongside the bus and it signals to pull out, or even starts to move out, I will move closer to the bus. The driver has a good view down the side of the bus and by moving in you make it impossible for the driver to pull out any more till you have gone past. I think if you move away from the bus, which seems the 'safe' manouevre, you actually encourage them to keep taking up the space you are in and forcing you out further in to the road. But you need to keep in mind that if getting closer does not stop them then you will need to move out parallel to them so it is vital to have looked over your shoulder to see what is behind you.I saw a guy on a pink geared bike do this very effectively on clerkenfix, I thought at the time he was a bit a bit audacious but i see now how it was working.
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• #43
^^^a little bit of strategic wobble has its place.
OR DOES IT???
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• #44
I have a way of dealing with buses that seems counter-intuitive but works well. If I am alongside the bus and it signals to pull out, or even starts to move out, I will move closer to the bus. The driver has a good view down the side of the bus and by moving in you make it impossible for the driver to pull out any more till you have gone past. I think if you move away from the bus, which seems the 'safe' manouevre, you actually encourage them to keep taking up the space you are in and forcing you out further in to the road. But you need to keep in mind that if getting closer does not stop them then you will need to move out parallel to them so it is vital to have looked over your shoulder to see what is behind you.
Bus drivers tend to be pretty good with their mirrors, so this seems like a good technique. You could also look into the mirror to ensure you can see the driver's face. If you can see them, they can (and hopefully, will) see you. -
• #45
"If you can't see my mirrors, I can't see you". Those stickers on the back of large vehicles can be less than useful if, as you follow a vehicle, you are thinking "yes, and if you don't look in your mirrors then you can't see me either" as you ride behind constantly waiting for them to check.
Bus drivers do not, in general, impress me much but buses at least have the advantage of being fairly predictable in their movements; they pull in only at bus stops and the drivers don't suddenly decide to head off down a side road. -
• #46
I have a way of dealing with buses that seems counter-intuitive but works well. If I am alongside the bus and it signals to pull out, or even starts to move out, I will move closer to the bus.
Hmmm, I wonder if that psychology could be applied to pedestrians... Typical scenario: Pedestrian is crossing the road ahead from right to left, has already crossed halfway and is waiting for a gap in traffic, I'm the next bit of traffic approaching and taking the lane. I move slightly to the left to maintain a safe margin, they take a step forward into the gap. Rinse and repeat.
I'm not suggesting veering toward the pedestrian, just making it obvious you're going to hold your line which is quite difficult when someone keeps stepping closer... Eye contact doesn't stop them in my experience.
Pete.
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• #47
You can also simply slow and let them pass, if possible. It's often the best option. People tend to be very surprised and you can top it off with a smile and an 'after you'. This is by far the best way of making them aware that they may just not have been paying attention.
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• #48
weave about all over the road make car drivers intentionally nervous make those feet hover over the brake pedals then smile and say have a nice day :)
I did that when I first commuted on the road as a very very nervous noob. Didn't smile though as was scared someone would run me over. Panic attack at E&C roundabout anyone? Cycle training before and after helped and I've another training lesson coming up next Saturday.
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• #49
You can also simply slow and let them pass, if possible. It's often the best option.
I try and avoid waving people anywhere at all... if they got hit by someone/something else (undertaking cyclist?) it'd feel totally my fault, cos I'd been like "you're safe yo!"
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• #50
I wouldn't wave them on unless I'd checked the situation carefully. It all depends on the circumstances. Sometimes it's of course better to keep going if you realise that others travelling along with you aren't likely to stop and that it would only cause confusion if you stopped, e.g. on a street with two traffic lanes in your direction.
I think the point about 'eye contact' is a little too specific. The point - for me at least - is that you make a conscious effort to communicate to the traffic around you that you know they are there and will make an effort to accomodate them - i.e not cycle like a retard. Most reasonable drivers reciprocate and give you space. If you think they won't and there is a narrow area ahead - take the lane, You can't do this safely if you don't look first.
I've mentioned somewhere on here before that *actual *eye contact is quite hard - what with windscreens, other traffic bits (as you mention) and traffic. Al glance at the windshield usually suffices.
jus my 2 cents...