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why?
Not link whoring but sometimes it's easier to repost from the blog:
Cycle lanes are convenient for motorists, not cyclists
1.11.09 by Buffalo Bill‘The bikeway system was designed for the convenience of motorists – the safety arguments are bunkum,’ says [John Forester](http://bit.ly/3lVjK1), in this [L.A. Times article](http://bit.ly/1hRgBr). John Franklin, author of [Cyclecraft](http://bit.ly/2x42my), probably the most authoritative book on riding a bike, reckons that [INDENT] it seems that the first cycle paths were to meet the needs of cyclists in terms of comfort and ease of riding. Soon after road standards improved, however, the motive for building tracks changed to one of getting cyclists out of the way of motor traffic. Only in the Netherlands does there seem to have remained a pro-cycling reason for building paths. There is little evidence of cyclists demanding cycle paths for reasons of safety until the 1970s; indeed much of the opposition to using paths in earlier years was on account of the added danger present. [/INDENT][from [A History of Cycle Paths](http://bit.ly/16jhjB)] My own opposition to cycle lanes or paths, or super-highways, as the Mayor of London likes to call them, is [a matter of record](http://bit.ly/2ye8yZ) -
Look at the path that runs parallel to oxford street (can't remember the name of the street, I'm sure most of you know what I'm talking about), it's a nightmare: peds walking all over it, plus the fact that it's barely wide enough for 2 bikes to be crossing each other. A fine example of a supposedly safe bike path made hazardous by poor planning IMHO.
Someone mentioned people who don't seem aware of the dangers on the road earlier...I'm not sure they're as bad as those who are too aware of the dangers, hugging the kerb and making themselves an "easy target". -
My own opposition to cycle lanes or paths, or super-highways, as the Mayor of London likes to call them, is [a matter of record](http://bit.ly/2ye8yZ)I think there's a high barrier to having a really good cycle path network. Until last year, I'd have been totally in agreement with you, but spending a few months in Copenhagen has changed my mind somewhat.
When a separated network of cycle paths has its own prioritised traffic signals, right-of-way, and sufficient size to be useful, it's great. The Copenhagen method is a volte-face from the British one: motor vehicles are put into a narrow lane on the side of the street and given the lowest priority.
I still get a bleak chuckle from the fact that a "Cycling Superhighway" is narrower and more pointless than a regular Danish bike lane that you'd find on any street.
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Does make you think that bike lanes are, at best, counter productive, and likely actually to be part of the problem.
Yep in most cases. I feel they encourage closer passing and discourse a sharing of the road more your lane my lane type mentality. Add in the fact that most are not fit for use and it's a mess. I do think bike lanes can have there place where properly built in some areas / junctions, but more of an exception rather than a rule
The tipper drivers opinion is quite important here- it shows that cyclists are viewed as an impediment to be got past, and that there is a general sense of "get in your bloody lane and out of my way".
Yep exactly.
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I think there's a high barrier to having a really good cycle path network. Until last year, I'd have been totally in agreement with you, but spending a few months in Copenhagen has changed my mind somewhat.
When a separated network of cycle paths has its own prioritised traffic signals, right-of-way, and sufficient size to be useful, it's great. The Copenhagen method is a volte-face from the British one: motor vehicles are put into a narrow lane on the side of the street and given the lowest priority.
I still get a bleak chuckle from the fact that a "Cycling Superhighway" is narrower and more pointless than a regular Danish bike lane that you'd find on any street.
Copenhagen is probably best practice - of all the cities that I have ridden in, I would say only Munster has better cycling infrastructure.
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This from southward cyclists list posted by barry mason
"Friday 16 April from 6pm until Sunday morning the Shard adds
insult to death with the UK's biggest ever concrete pour. 700 lorries in
36 hours. 20 an hour. One every three minutes:
http://www.betterbankside.co.uk/news/development-news/1837-the-shard
Critical Mass anybody?" -
jesus christ, some people here really need to get off their pedestal....
firstly, his english isn't great, but hey, not everyone is 'fortunate' enough to be as middle-class as you are, okay?
secondly, his tone is very reasonable in the post; he is merely putting across his point of view and common observances, some of which are probably true of a lot of those people who do what he does, so it would be good for all of us to take note of what, although not ideal, is reality, instead of insulting him and trying to come up with an adequate cyclist's defence for every point he makes.
Drivers are no more often in the wrong than cyclists are... many people here, myself included, know that we behave far differently on the road when we are on a bike than we do when we are driving. We think we have a right to do certain things....The best thing we can do here is take note of what is going on in reality, have some mutual understanding, and try to avoid more deaths/injuries. This is far more productive than passionately advocating for some kind of commuter utopia where 'good' always prevails...
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The best thing we can do here is take note of what is going on in reality, have some mutual understanding, and try to avoid more deaths/injuries. This is far more productive than passionately advocating for some kind of commuter utopia where 'good' always prevails...
no need to wait for any commuter utopia. Education is quite effective to foster mutual understanding,. massive subsidised training of cyclists, and on-bike training and cyclist awareness sessions for lorry drivers
Which is already beginning to happen check out this scheme in Lambeth for hgv (and all essesntial) drivers which is being taken up by other boroughs
http://www.cycletraining.co.uk/news/2008/11/post.php
and accross london for cyclists
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/cycling/11689.aspx -
This thread might have been dead for a while. But wanted to find the right place to post these pictures.
"... a HGV drivers view..."
or lack of it
Buffalo_Bill
demoncleaner
mr_tom
TheBrick(Tommy)
moth
skydancer
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starfish&coffee
jaitch
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O'Shane-
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From the cab - a HGV drivers view
Posted by
@big_daddy_wayne
pictures. we need pictures. get cameras! :)