General Election 2010

Whites are best !!!

Asians are rubbish !!!!

The chinese are up to something !!

Australians are racist !!!!

I can't understand how you can't.

I am going to have to agree with seeds here, I can't see a genetic basis for a meaningful concept of "race".

(seriously)

(not that my last few posts were not serious).

Blacks back in !!!!!

More wine !!!!

I disagree- but the article is very balanced, and allows for personal bias- undoubtedly the reason it has been cited so often.
IMO-
it says that behaviour based aspects of race are unsupported by race, whereas the physical attributes are supported.
furthermore- allow it allows for and highlighs a blurring of the boundaries- i feel that this sentence sums up the article best:
"When large numbers of loci are evaluated, it is often possible to infer individual ancestry, at least approximately"

loci are lovations of genes on a chromosome, and the individual ancestry- is down to what I would term 'race'- shared ancestral attributes.
therefore- a genetic background to 'race'.

Henry

@ seeds-
you questioned my standpoint that race can be defined genetically:
it can and has been shown in my two references.

I have redefined my understanding of race, as instead of blase posting I sat and thought it through for a while (please read my previous post which I edited)....

Thanks again Henry for your considered posts. However, I still strongly disagree with you.

"Race = shared ancestral attributes" does not seem to be a genetic definition to me.

I really strongly think that there is no acceptable scientific way to define race and that therefore we should accept that the term is a convenient shorthand, at best.

Otherwise we move into Jim Watson territory. I've met him, and he seemed like a nice old man (we had a short conversation in CSHL about tennis) but his views on race are some of the stupidest that I've ever heard.

More on your two references coming soon, if my gin-based enthusiasm doesn't desert me.

I am going to have to agree with seeds here, I can't see a genetic basis for a meaningful concept of "race".

.

as in- you don't think that there are races? or you don't think that the inherent differences in people- such as susceptibility to disease- have genetic backgrounds?

I genuinely don't understand what you mean.

If its that race cannot be defined by genetic means alone- maybe i can understand that, but to deny any genetic involvement is, in my mind, unsupportable.

I'd actually ignore the first reference- its not what I'd hoped for on further reading, though it is very well written and researched.

. . . . there is no acceptable scientific way to define race and that therefore we should accept that the term is a convenient shorthand, at best.

Yes, that's my point.

No need for 'at best' either as people don't (typically) hold racist views on scientific basis, so shorthand is all we need.

Otherwise we move into Jim Watson territory. I've met him, and he seemed like a nice old man (we had a short conversation in CSHL about tennis) but his views on race are some of the stupidest that I've ever heard.

How are you using the word 'race' here ?

[falls off chair]

"Race = shared ancestral attributes" does not seem to be a genetic definition to me.

this sentence I will challenge head on.
you must provide me with how you understand what a 'gene' is before we can continue.
otherwise- it is pointless.

as in- you don't think that there are races? or you don't think that the inherent differences in people- such as susceptibility to disease- have genetic backgrounds?

I genuinely don't understand what you mean.

If its that race cannot be defined by genetic means alone- maybe i can understand that, but to deny any genetic involvement is, in my mind, unsupportable.

I think racial differences are 'spectral' (for want of a better term) - they flow from group to group (unless a group has been isolated for an extended period, but even here the tangent is only temporal but still related) so it's pointless to point to one group and claim this as a distinct race when on either side the spectrum spreads out.

Hope that makes sense, I am drunk, I have eaten a whole bottle of Blossom Hill.

Go back to Turkey you fucking racist - and take your 'Olympic Race Purity' ideal with you.

like I told you, i am half black from the waist down. no olympic purity ideal here.

like I told you, i am half black from the waist down. no olympic purity ideal here.

That's how you lot cheat at the Olympics, you come out for the warm up in full track suit and when asked to line up for the start reveal your magnificent 'coloured' legs.

Bastard.

third leg.

lfgss . . . . . '2010 elections' to race purity and genetic drift in less than 10 pages.

My own petard has turned around and given me a thorough hoisting. Or has it?

How are you using the word 'race' here ?

With the quotation marks that we've been using for the last couple of pages.

this sentence I will challenge head on.
you must provide me with how you understand what a 'gene' is before we can continue.
otherwise- it is pointless.

I wouldn't say it's pointless. If we can't define a gene, then defining a scientific basis for "race" seems a bit premature?

FYI - I've run out of tonic and moved onto vodka-based drinks. The bottle of Lambrusco is now a distant memory. You can expect my style / spelling to change accordingly. Hic.

lfgss . . . . . '2010 elections' to race purity and genetic drift in less than 10 pages.

I was going to mention this, but I worried that someone might take it as a cue to start punning.

third leg.

Technically, in an Olympic track event if you have a big enough cock you can place, on it's tip, a shoe - and there is nothing in the rule book to prevent you from running the race on all threes.

I wouldn't say it's pointless. If we can't define a gene, then defining a scientific basis for "race" seems a bit premature?

scientists haven't resolved the definition, but they still talk about the genetic effects.

actually fuck it- 'we' still talk about genetic effects, since I am a scientist, officially.

I am putting my monies on a Lib/Con pact before the morning.

I am putting my monies on a Lib/Con pact before the morning.

a safe, but a depressing bet.

scientists haven't resolved the definition, but they still talk about the genetic effects.

actually fuck it- 'we' still talk about genetic effects, since I am a scientist, officially.

'scientists' ?

Are these the same 'scientists' behind climate gate ?

yeah, the cunts....
bastard liars.

and H1N1.

and bad AIDZ

yeah, the cunts....
bastard liars.

and H1N1.

and bad AIDZ

Big fuckign Pharma.