What can you tell us Yanks about Healthcare in the UK

i assume drug prices are much higher in the US than the UK - is this correct? if the US healthcare system was nationalised presumably this would result in lower drug prices (and therefore lower the overall cost of healthcare) as the government would be able to exert much more power in negotiating prices as the main buyer. I don't see anyone in the US arguing this point, maybe I am wrong.

Another point which we don't really have to deal with in the UK is the culture of litigation and the level of payouts which people can be awarded. I wonder if the US courts would still award multi million dollar awards for people suing doctors when the government would ultimately have to foot the bill.

I wonder how this compares to VA hospitals. My step-dad (err...mom's ex-husband) has nothing but bad things to say about the VA.

Probably better, at least from what I could tell. But I have limited experience...

i carry a European Health Insurance Card as a British Citizen which is free to apply for and valid for 5 years.. and enables me have free NHS standard treatment across all EU member states and Switzerland.. very useful when cycling across the alps..

i carry a European Health Insurance Card as a British Citizen which is free to apply for and valid for 5 years.. and enables me have free NHS standard treatment across all EU member states and Switzerland.. very useful when cycling across the alps..

I have this too, and carry it with me all times, even here!

So overall how's the care?

How much does it add to your tax burden?

Is it worth it?

Would you rather not have it?

While I was unemployed (due to being mentally ill), the NHS helped get me better...and all for free.
I can safely say that If there wasn't that system in place, then I'd probably still be quite bad.
Now that I'm back at work, I am taxed to bejeezus, but I owe the NHS one so its all good!
;)

I've worked as part of a multidisciplinary team - amongst Occupational Therapists, Nurses, Dietitians, Speech Therapists and doctors, and i can honestly say that the main objective is the patient. The frontline staff really do try to give the best of their ability, but are so very, very restricted by the politics of the NHS. Money politics....
Hospitals are a shrewdly run business, with beds at their minimal... so money then becomes a big part of how the system runs.... get more patients in - kick the "outliers" out.... this process means that those discharged too early end up being readmitted for further treatment......
Oh shit - am i still typing? What was your question?

Seriously, I'd like to think that my training has made me a better individual, and i really do care for patients. But everyone has their shit day, and in healthcare - this shows up very clearly.
(I'm off again)

Not sure how relevant this is as it is comparing my experience of privatevs public service in England. I broke my leg pretty badly a few years ago and metal got screwed to my leg in thanks to the NHS then taken out a year later courtesy of Bupa. The level of care was almost the same in both (apart from a monumental fuck up on pain control on one instance by the NHS), the people treating me were the same (some working for both the NHS and Bupa), the only big difference between the two services was the waiting around. When being treated by the NHS there was a lot of waiting around and uncertainty when I would be seen by doctors, surgeons etc. Compared to private when if they said they'd be there at 1pm then they would be there bang on 1pm.

But that is private medicine in the UK - they're very good at hand-holding, bedside manner, etc, and they're able to do the simple stuff, but anything reasonably complicated is handed back to be done by the NHS anyway.

The other big issue with the American system, that hasn't been touched on, is the effect it has had on medical research. Speaking as a former employee, the reason that Big Pharma is what it is (venal, corrupt and not very interested in pointing its money in the direction of malaria, AIDS and so on, preferring "lifestyle" diseases) is because it makes its money in the American system, where it can market directly to consumers and charge huge fees to insurance companies. The medical research agenda for the entire world is set by a perverse system of economic incentives in the US, and academia is corrupted along the way. I don't want to derail the thread into a discussion of Big Pharma (well, secretly I do), but if the US went for socialised medicine it would be wonderful to watch their business model collapse a bit further.

Hospitals are a shrewdly run business, with beds at their minimal... so money then becomes a big part of how the system runs.... get more patients in - kick the "outliers" out.... this process means that those discharged too early end up being readmitted for further treatment......

To some extent that's due to several decades of governments trying to move the system towards a more "capitalist" model, with an internal market and public-private partnerships.

I hear that mate.

And if these doctors and nurses were British then all their training has been payed for by British taxpayers. Yet they are then allowed to deplete the NHS by going to work in private medicine and increase the amount of time the people who payed for their training have to wait for treatment.

Increasingly, though, services provided by the NHS are commissioned by people in the public purse from private companies. So, in some forms of complex care you might find yourself in a private facility, run by a private company, but with everything paid for by the NHS. There's no longer a clear-cut distinction between NHS and private. In fact, the NHS is moving to separate its commissioning functions from its provider functions completely to encourage competition between public providers and private providers.

i assume drug prices are much higher in the US than the UK - is this correct? if the US healthcare system was nationalised presumably this would result in lower drug prices (and therefore lower the overall cost of healthcare) as the government would be able to exert much more power in negotiating prices as the main buyer. I don't see anyone in the US arguing this point, maybe I am wrong.

Another point which we don't really have to deal with in the UK is the culture of litigation and the level of payouts which people can be awarded. I wonder if the US courts would still award multi million dollar awards for people suing doctors when the government would ultimately have to foot the bill.

I think a big proportion of the litigious nature of the US is due to the fact that people don't have health insurance and have to sue as a means of covering gigantic medical bills. So, if people didn't have to worry about health care costs when something happens to them, people wouldn't have to resort to suing as a means of paying for medical bills.

There are of course tons of people taking advantage of the system and suing companies purely for the financial rewards. This in turn also raises the cost of insurance for the average person.

In fact, the NHS is moving to separate its commissioning functions from its provider functions completely to encourage "competition" between public providers and private providers.

Fixed, as the "competitive" element is often rigged... :)

So privatism is a fucking cancer basically?

A link to this thread is posted on the MSNBC Politics board.

http://boards.msn.com/MSNBCboards/thread.aspx?threadid=1165584

Doesn't work in Firefox = Wank

Sorry

Doesn't work in Firefox = Wank

Sorry

Works for me, Ive got the latest version of Firefox running

Running Chrome..

Message boards - unsupported web client
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i assume drug prices are much higher in the US than the UK - is this correct? if the US healthcare system was nationalised presumably this would result in lower drug prices (and therefore lower the overall cost of healthcare) as the government would be able to exert much more power in negotiating prices as the main buyer. I don't see anyone in the US arguing this point, maybe I am wrong.

If you're talking about wholesale price, I don't think this is true. NICE, the clinical body that approves drugs to be offered as treatment in the UK, isn't allowed to negotiate prices with drug companies, which sounds crazy.

NHS saved my life AND proved I have a brain..

For stuff like GPs and A&E in London I think the volume of people seeking help and the private practice stuff hampers 'service' but in a proper emergency (as above) I was rushed to the premier brain surgery ward and operated on multiple times. I still get regular MRIs and it all cost me nothing. Even as foreign scum it's free. So, as much as I hate having to dive on the phone and call on the day I want an appointment with a GP, I can't really complain too much about the NHS. Australia has a similar thing in Medicare.

NHS saved my life AND proved I have a brain..

For stuff like GPs and A&E in London I think the volume of people seeking help and the private practice stuff hampers 'service' but in a proper emergency (as above) I was rushed to the premier brain surgery ward and operated on multiple times. I still get regular MRIs and it all cost me nothing. Even as foreign scum it's free. So, as much as I hate having to dive on the phone and call on the day I want an appointment with a GP, I can't really complain too much about the NHS. Australia has a similar thing in Medicare.

Its scary how your nose disappears!

Doesn't work in Firefox = Wank

Sorry

Works for me too.

NHS saved my life AND proved I have a brain..

For stuff like GPs and A&E in London I think the volume of people seeking help and the private practice stuff hampers 'service' but in a proper emergency (as above) I was rushed to the premier brain surgery ward and operated on multiple times. I still get regular MRIs and it all cost me nothing. Even as foreign scum it's free. So, as much as I hate having to dive on the phone and call on the day I want an appointment with a GP, I can't really complain too much about the NHS. Australia has a similar thing in Medicare.

It looks just like you Hippy! I want to see your brain with one of these after 10 pints.

That's scary!

i assume drug prices are much higher in the US than the UK - is this correct?

No, I noticed that - here, a 16 tab box of store-brand ibuprofen is around 30p, in the States, where I've lived, it would be upwards of $1.50, possibly even close to $2. Bigger containers cost less, so something like a 50 tab container of ibuprofen might cost $6.

Its scary how your nose disappears!

Is your nose as wide as your head?