Time Trial / Time Trialling / TT

Before I list this stuff properly (note the brakes are on TTF already, full disclosure), any interest in TriRig Wattshop and aero skewers? Omega One and X are £200 and £150 respectively with all the fittings, Wattshop stuff is brand new so say £130 for the risers and £65 for the clamps. Pinheads I don't know, £30?

1 Attachment

Time Trialling on Fixed

Used to be quite a thing. Here are a couple of surprising photos from the 1949 Grand Prix des Nations (AKA World TT Championship)

That year's event was won by Charles Coste (on gears), but in fourth place was Rene Berton who rode fixed:
Result

1. C. Coste 3 hr.41 m. 33 secs.

2. Van Est 3 41 46

3. Blomme 3 41 51

4. Berton 3 42 05.

Coppi was 8th with 3.45. 27 and L. Bobet 9th with 3.45.43.

The distance (not stated in Miroir Sprint) must have been about 140 kilometres and it wasn't flat.
It's surprising the result was so close given the distance. Berton won in 1948, but I haven't yet found that issue of the magazine.

It seems remarkable that it was possible to get such a good result in this event, on fixed, as late as 1949. Makes you think!

There are four pictures so I will spread them over two posts. The quality is the best I can manage - these are photographs of photographs.

I expect you can google translate the captions, but I can offer my translation if anyone wants it.

PS I wish I knew what his gear was - I guess 52 x 16. That back wheel looks like 24 spokes - quite risky for some one his size, but it must have held out.

2 Attachments

Here we have Rene Berton on the road and his D.S., the great Francis Pelissier, looking pensively at his 'foal'.

Is this interesting? (genuine question).

2 Attachments

yes, fantastic.

Are there any tts currently held that have a category for pre 1950s bikes? Would be interesting to know a direct comparison.

I recently read, and loved, I Like Alf https://www.mousehold-press.co.uk/book/i-like-alf-14-lessons-from-the-life-of-alf-engers/ so am very much inspired for a few hilly tts early this season

Are there any tts currently held that have a category for pre 1950s bikes?

That would be a narrow field, A3crg run a "heritage" class in some of their Goodwood races, but the oldest grouping is pre-1992, which makes me feel ancient given that bikes I bought new with my own money qualify 👴

yes, fantastic.

Are there any tts currently held that have a category for pre 1950s bikes? Would be interesting to know a direct comparison.

As Tester says it would be a bit too restrictive. A direct comparison to the 'Nations' of 1949 couldn't really be done now because the roads are so different.

However, I have a suggestion. How about having an lfgss 25 championship by simply attaching our riders to an existing event as private time trials? I think the Twickenham/Hounslow/Westerley Interclub held on the West of Windsor course in May would be ideal for this purpose - I feel sure the organisers would welcome some extra riders.

How the machines are specified would be up for discussion, but surely we would not want to have variable gears. If it were just up to me, I would not allow anything 'aero' beyond dropped handlebars, which would pretty much take us back to Rene Berton's bike in that photo. This seems desirable because, by excluding special TT kit, it would make the competition open to anyone with a single gear bike.

Before we discuss bikes the first question must be Is anyone interested?

I would be happy to provide a (second hand) trophy at my own expense.

The West of Windsor course seems suitable for this since it's not a dragstrip and, although far from flat, it has seen some good rides done on fixed . 'Staggy', who posts occasionally on the forum, has done a short 58 there on fixed.

If this is a success, I will suggest the lfgss CC should be invited to join the Interclub as a full member for 2025.

I've got a Hounslow Committee meeting next month - if anyone wants to take up the idea, I'd like to be able to report it at that meeting.

Maybe… What date in May?

The Interclub 25 is on May 19th.

Fredtc?

Anyone else?

Potentially interested, Chris. I’m not a member of the LGFSS club tho. Would that matter?

Only thing I would say about acceptable equipment is that a lot of folk ride their “fixies” with bullhorn bars. So many just say no deep section rims, aero extensions or aero helmets??

Olah hive mind.

I intend to do some TTs this year after dipping my toe in the water last year.

Mostly short ones, Bristol South Lake TT and some local 10s

If I had say 800 to spend (incl skinsuit and helmet) should I...

A. look for a cheap 2nd hand tt bike, rim brake etc. I've got some posh 50mm carbon wheels that could go on it. Regularly see cannondale slices go for not much money.

B. Adapt my Trek Madone with some nice modern aero bars etc.

My instinct tells me that the madone is probably more aero that most old tt bikes anyway. Its AXS so I can fit blips to the aero bars for easy shifting.

Thoughts welcome

1 Attachment

And before anyone says just race the road bike category. I'd like to go as quick as possible.

TT bike could be faster if it gets you into a better position. Aero bars on the madone, a decent skinsuit and a helmet to start with I think

Will see you at the lake :)

Yeah - I would start with some aero bars on the madone and a nopinz ski suit.
What size head are you - I have a couple of spare TT helmets I think…

I quite enjoy the Lake TT course, just rolling and twisty enough to be interesting.

Will order a Friction Racing team nopinz suit, I'm just waiting for a discount code to pop up for club kit.

Il look out for some aero bars for the madone for now. Maybe some deeper wheels too.

I've not used this year's cyclescheme yet... so if I really get into TTs I may just buy a new bike. Although the prices for most bikes are a bit nuts these days.

I'm a medium in most helmet brands. What have you got hidden in the garage?

Cheers

I have a couple of Medium NoPinz suits I'd like to get rid of if interested. Also a small Bell Javelin helmet 👍

Sam

Potentially interested, Chris. I’m not a member of the LGFSS club tho. Would that matter?

Only thing I would say about acceptable equipment is that a lot of folk ride their “fixies” with bullhorn bars. So many just say no deep section rims, aero extensions or aero helmets??

'Acceptable Kit' This needs to be a matter of agreement between those who want to ride. I'm just making the suggestion and I'm not going to ride so I shouldn't try to dictate.

However, my suggestion would be to keep things as simple as possible. The idea is to have a forum championship and the more people who can be persuaded to give it a try, the better.

So assuming we agree on single gears, the next questions would be whether to allow clip on aero bars and disc wheels; my instinct would be not to allow either. As to deep section rims - it's not normal now to have shallow rims you will have to decide what depth is acceptable. Since helmets are now compulsory, it might seem a bit odd to ban aero helmets, but it might be possible if you could define 'aero' in this context - probably not worth bothering arguing about.

The key is to make this accessible to as many as possible. If this year's HDiJ riders could be persuaded to turn up all they'd really need to do would be to remove mudguards from the bikes they used last month. At least, that's the sort of agreement I would favour.

lfgss membership wouldn't matter from the event organisers point of view, but if it's a club championship you couldn't really claim to be a club champion without being a member!

I’m not a member of the LGFSS club tho.

Yes you are. We all are.

Ifonlyiwerebelgian

Olah hive mind.

I intend to do some TTs this year after dipping my toe in the water last year.

Mostly short ones, Bristol South Lake TT and some local 10s

Did that dip of the toe suggest you've got some talent?

Perhaps it did, since you're planning to do more, but it's important to remember that bike racing is mostly about talent and hard work. It's not retail therapy.

Talent, nope not really. I just like riding bikes as fast I can manage.

Hard work...sometimes

I'd need a crowbar to get into a medium nopinz anything!

Not sure I have a suitable bike. I’ve got something round tubes with 25mm rims but modern steel with etap. Could ride it on that?

before anyone says just race the road bike category

You wouldn't be trying to head us off if you didn't already know that was the right answer.

You need a TT helmet, skinsuit and aero overshoes to be as fast as possible so I'd get those and and some clip on bars for the madone and shave your legs!

After that you can start thinking about a TT frame, aero bars, disc wheel, which front wheel, what's the lowest crr tyre that fits the front wheel most aero dynamically, chain waxing, power meter, aero chainring covers, 1x, chainring size, oversize pulley wheels, aero derailleur covers......

As a tight Scotsman, I’m loathe to spend money, but I got a carbon Planet X TT bike with carbon disc rear and deep carbon front wheel, amongst other bits, for the hefty sum of £350.

So while I am guilty of buying more bits, it doesn’t have to be at great expense.

This is the reason I never did tts in my 20s. It's a bloody money pit.

Legs have been smooth as a babies bum for 15 years.