RLJ (Red Light Jumping). (The definitive bikeradar thread)

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Probably BS, but it does sound likely, I'm not surprise they're focusing on this, they're breaking the law after all.

I understand the vagueries of the law around ASL infringements, that said, even if you apply the most laisez-faire reading of it, an offence occurs almost every time I'm stopped in one at busy times.

I'm also not taking issue with being stopped and fined for my RLJ, I'm just surprised by the assertion that cyclist RLJing is such a high-ranking cause of fatalities - I would have thought HGVs and careless driver behaviour ranked higher.

As left turning trucks keep killing cyclists the claim that rlj is the major killer is clearly bullshit

This

As left turning trucks,*** TfL*** and Crossrail keep killing cyclists the claim that rlj is the major killer is clearly bullshit

Fixed.

As left turning trucks keep killing cyclists the claim that rlj is the major killer is clearly bullshit

quite - last time I heard a stat on this HGVs were involved in 50% (eight out of sixteen?) cyclist fatalities in London in the previous year?

anyway, I don't want to derail the thread, just surprised at the claims by a cycle-mounted officer.

The percentage of HGV (specifically the tipper) are very low in London, I think I read something like 2%? yet they still managed to be the main cause of deaths toward cyclists.

anyway, I don't want to derail the thread, just surprised at the claims by a cycle-mounted officer.
The one time (years ago) that I was pulled over for RLJ (similar circumstances) I got a similar speech - nonsense then and now. They have to give some justification for spending the time and "because you've committed a technical breach of the law and we've been told by our bosses that today is to be National Be A Pain In The 'Aris To Cyclists Day" doesn't sound so good.

I would not listen to any of the plod nodders

Saw one cycling in the gutter the other day. Due to his nonexistent observation skills and lack of correct position he had to stop behind a parked car and then pull out after a stream of traffic.

If he had not been in the gutter and actually been in primary position he would never had needed to stop. I say this because I was about ten metres behind him.

I told him this at the next red light and that he needed cycle training. I then ran the red light but he could not catch up with me.

hah!

I told him this at the next red light and that he needed cycle training. I then ran the red light but he could not catch up with me.

so your cycle training taught you to run red lights or were you suggesting his cycle training would differ from yours?

"I told him this at the next red light and that he needed cycle training. I then ran the red light but he could not catch up with me."

Bullshit.

It taught me correct observation and risk assessment.

Waiting at a red light when there are no cars coming seems ridiculous to me.

It taught me correct observation and risk assessment.

Waiting at a red light when there are no cars coming seems ridiculous to me.

So you take the training and then ignore bits of it that seem ridiculous. Thanks for clearing that up.

So you take the training and then ignore bits of it that seem ridiculous. Thanks for clearing that up.
Always worked for me in the case of eg ridiculously complicated stoppage drills on L85A1s :-)

So you take the training and then ignore bits of it that seem ridiculous. Thanks for clearing that up.

yep that is the case

it was on my cycle training i learned that entering an ASL from the right hand side is illegal, you should only enter via the broken line which tends to only be accessible from the left.

as such the cycle path advocates you undertake on your way up to the ASL and puts you in the most danger

so i could:
wait in the line,
cycle up on the left hand side, not knowing when the light is likely to change and risk being crushed by a keltbray lorry
or filter up the right hand side (perfectly allowed) and then enter the asl from the right (not allowed)

i hope that helps clarify

nb what i did learn was also to look and assess if filtering is appropriate, so i actually filter a lot less since the training, however i very rarely enter an ASL from the left hand side due to the potential risk to myself

ha yes I forgot about that! who'd have thunk it?

However, Oliver Schick jumped a red on the overnight to Brighton. FACT

yep that is the case

blah, blah...

i hope that helps clarify

Yep, it clarifies that you think you are above the law. Not sure if you drive a car but if you do I hope you don't drive with the same attitude to the laws of the road otherwise you are as bad as the drivers you constantly moan about...

Yep, it clarifies what you think blah blah I am incapable of making any decision for myself regarding my own safety possibly because I cannot use my brain...

So you wait at every light and never filter from the right into asls?

This is also part of the problem of having ridiculous legislation whereby people start to ignore the law

Eg the holborn gyratory, being made to wait at left turning red lights etc

I am clearly not the only one who makes such assessments for themselves.

Its not that I run every red-light but chose to do so when I observe and assess it to be safe, much like the filtering issue.

also its a matter of responsibility

cars jumping red lights have huge potential to hurt others, cyclists will tend to mainly hurt themselves if they fuck this up (though of course they may scratch/dent a car and also traumatise the driver)

this is exactly why boris is contemplating allowing left turns at red lights, its about level of risk incurred

Yes I wait at every red light, just like I do in my car. It is not for you or others to determine which laws are right and wrong I'm afraid. You choose to ignore the red light law, someone else (van drIver) chooses to ignore some other law. Who is right?

Any road user who decides which laws should be for them or not should not be on the road.

so your notion of right/correct is solely determined by the law?

interesting

so if turning left at red lights is eventually allowed it then becomes "right"?

its fine, we may just chose to disagree as to what sets our moral compass

was racism right until it was made illegal?

If you are using the road then the laws of the road apply. What if I decide that it is okay to drive everywhere at 60, is that okay? If not then who are you to say, I know let's let the law decide!

It is not for you or others to determine which laws are right and wrong I'm afraid.

Surely SOMEONE has to determine which laws are right and wrong? And who is to say that they are right?

so you think racism was right when it was not illegal

lovely