Bad traders

Nasty ol' shit!

Cipolinni looks bad indeed, those are very clearly used rather than NOS (New. Old Stock).

Very clearly false advertising by Cipolinni.

CharlieTheBikeMonger, glad that is all sorted*. Looking back through it (because I can read the edited stuff too), does appear to be a lot of confusion and overlap and nothing major.

However... not too happy that everyone feels they should rip lovecloughfixie a new arsehole for bringing it up. The right response to bad traders is to get that shit resolved. And I do find that a lot of stuff that I'm PM'd about does fall into the class of misunderstanding, impatience, bad communication rather than actually any intentional bad actions on behalf of either party.

As poor show as it is to tarnish a seller without getting all of the evidence and doing your best to get things sorted, it's also poor show to bully a buyer in the same vein.

The forum mantra "Is this resolved yet?" is the right response, unless it's Cipolinni selling used stuff as NOS.

• Disclosure: I have bought stuff from CTBM in the past, service was good.
  

CharlieTheBikeMonger, glad that is all sorted. ...

However... not too happy that everyone feels they should rip lovecloughfixie a new arsehole for bringing it up.

Hmm - not sure I agree that the arsehole-ripping was simply because LCF brought up perceived problems with his/her transaction with CTBM: surely it's much more about the way in which it was done.

To me, there's a massive difference - perhaps only about presentation, but I think it's more substantive - between saying 'I've placed this order, it's late, I'm a bit concerned about the lack of communication - I am worried that I won't see my goods at all,' and leaping in with accusations of, essentially, fraud. And it wasn't just once: each update brought further abuse from LCF about CTBM's business practices.

As you say, much of this is about a lack of clear communication, in what by both accounts was a slightly convoluted transaction (the e-cheque saga etc). Personally, I think it's pretty slipshod of CTBM to not be in a position to respond to customer phonecalls or emails for two or three days, especially where this relates to a booked and paid-for next-day delivery.

Taking on board the pressures of being a small operation with a (perhaps unusually?) high volume of transactions, it would be nice to think that either it might be possible to triage queries, or at the very least to add a wee note to the website to suggest delays may be likely. (Not that many customers would read it and take it in, but at least it would show willing ...)

That said, LCF hadn't just placed an order online - there'd been direct contact to sort out the payment issues, which you'd hope might give some reassurance that CTBM wasn't some faceless organisation set up simply to scam unsuspecting fixeh riders.

Even without such contact, I'd always be inclined to blame cock-up rather than conspiracy, at least until proven otherwise: LCF made it very clear that they were taking the opposite view. Again, I understand some of the frustrations of waiting for a delivery that simply doesn't turn up (and of the sheer waste in taking time off work if that's been necessary) - but especially where you've been given a tracking number, surely it's more likely that the courier is shit than that the retailer is running a scam, and perhaps it's more balanced to ask questions or raise concerns than to start making accusations. This is especially true given that LCF had bought stuff from CTBM before, albeit a small transaction.

As I say, I think the vitriol against LCF is because of the way the concerns were raised - failing the attitude test, perhaps - and while anything that smacks of bullying is unpleasant, even on a forum rather than in real life, it is a reflection of the robust nature of discourse here.

(For the record, I said earlier I thought LCF's behaviour made them look a bit of a cock. I still think that, and it's only reinforced by the earlier posting dredged up by Charlie.

I also think that the lack of response to LCF's emails and phone calls by CTBM was disappointing and, whatever the business pressures, I'm sure an earlier response would have been welcome and would have defused the situation seen here.

I think the eventual response and postings here from CTBM were fairly graceful and good-humoured, but I don't go along with folk bigging him up for refunding the next-day fee - it's the least I'd expect (especially as I assume the actual charge can be reclaimed from ParcelForce), though of course it's been done quickly and without quibble.

Wouldn't have any hesitation buying from him in the future, unless I've now made it onto his blacklist along with LCF ...)

[tl;dr - miscommunication's shit, and I'm a dull bastard with too much time on my hands.]

"get that shit resolved"... Could not agree more. And this was fully resolved four days before i even learnt of this thread, when I promptly replied to his only email, refunded the postage and offered a sincere apology. Leaving what was written on here as the only shit to get resolved.

Everything and everyone gets looked after eventually. There is only so much time in a day, and these days go on after midnight when needed. Incoming Comms, emails etc are quite rightly dealt with after customers bikes are built, after courier collection deadlines etc. (Sorry Jim, your bike is not going to be with you this week, i know you wanted if for an event this weekend, but i am reading emails instead). but it does all get done, you are in queue, you have to wait your turn.

I reported a blocked right of way to the council, they called me back about a week later, and the path was cleared about a month after that... I did not suspect the council of running a path / poll tax / brambles racket, or accuse them of this and insult them on a footpath forum. The rights of way guy was just busy, and I waited my turn. In the meantime there was a trail I could not ride, but I coped with that.

In this case the only ill effect of this work prioritisation is the postings on this forum. There was absolutely nothing I could have done once parcel force took the parcel.

This whole thing is a non-event, there is nothing to see here, move along now....

That's exactly what someone running a bike store/footpath racket would say.

Cipolinni sends out used goods purporting to be NOS http://www.lfgss.com/thread97859.html#post3299704 then when I pointed out the rear hub was used and asked for a refund he calmly states that they are NOS and there are no refunds..

Clearly laced up and used, scratched hubshell and original skewers replaced with mismatching low level crap that are also scratched up.
The pictures speak a thousand words

Complete and utter dick move by Cipolini, I'll be suprised if you get an actual refund off him, seems like a right twat looking at his previous posts.

My selling record says it all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It really does, that's all Ciplo's ever done is sell, and everything sold here is always on sale at retrobike aswell. He seems to not care about the rules or anything else on this site.
Does he do anything else or just use this site to sell? I can't find one post from Cipo that has not got something to do with selling or making money. I would of thought that someone so prolific in making money off this site would of at least had the decency to donate some small amount.

how do I neg rep someone? 'cause Cipo really deserves it.

Bottom left, click 'comment' and then 'I disapprove'.

Poor show from Chip there, especially having the cheek to say it's NOS after those photographs!

Considering the large amount of fee-free business Cipollini appears to do on this site and retrobike (and nearly always at the same time) I can't believe he's contesting this.
He should not only give a full refund, he should also let Mr Bump keep the shoddy goods too.
Cippolini's items are never exactly a bargain so surely good customer relations should be paramount?

I understand some of the frustrations of waiting for a delivery that simply doesn't turn up (and of the sheer waste in taking time off work if that's been necessary) - but especially where you've been given a tracking number, surely it's more likely that the courier is shit than that the retailer is running a scam, and perhaps it's more balanced to ask questions or raise concerns than to start making accusations. This is especially true given that LCF had bought stuff from CTBM before, albeit a small transaction.
]

The fact that Parcel Force don't do weekend also a contributing factor - you pay for 24 hours, you have to wait till Monday.

After threatening small claims I was offered £40 refund which I declined as I wanted the return postage cost of £2.20
So after reminding him of the law and the massive additional costs that he would incur with going to county court I've now been refunded the monies including the return postage so the matter is closed and the hubs will be posted back tomorrow.

Why Cipo couldn't just have accepted he was in the wrong from the off I'll never know but you've done yourself no favours...
Edit: Postage was £3.50 2nd, typical.
Return postage has now been refunded so it's sorted but wont be going back for seconds...

I've bought from (Campag brakeset) and sold to Cipolinni (Cannondale R1000) with no issues whatsoever... surprising to hear this.

the irony of bicycle nerds posting in this thread is amazing

They were here too?

It's like they hired someone who had never heard of the internet, gave them a bag of coke and pointed them at LFGSS.

Just so inept.

I knew a guy from Widnes who ate pie butties. True story

If there is one more incident involving Cipo, and if anything he sells is cross-posted to retrobike, then let me know.

I will ban him.

Having looked at his past posts, yeah I'm not seeing the love either. Either he can step up and abide by the rules, or frankly he can leave as I'm not sure anyone here would shed a tear.

I bought a Holdsworth frame from him on here a while ago. He listed it as Holdsworth Mistral (top model). It is a Holdsworth Record (bottom model) I realised this once i'd paid. I asked politely for a refund saying it's a Record not a Mistral, here's how you tell etc..

He said
"You may think that it is not a mistral,but i will disagree with you,even after your investigations."

It is a Record model, but even if it weren't, if a buyer asked me for money back and said don't send it, i would say fine. But not Cipollini. Bad seller best avoided.

The clue is in the nickname as it were.

greasy cyclo-douche.

doesn't dicki own that very bike?

edit: black decals.

The clue is in the nickname...

I dunno... At least original Cipo was entertaining in his buffoonery. Unlike those fucking wack hubs.

I bought a hybrid bike (Blue Trek 7500) from someone on here. It sold as VGC and it was very clean, but all the bearings were fucked and rusted.

name and shame!

I bought a hybrid bike (Blue Trek 7500) from someone on here. It sold as VGC and it was very clean, but all the bearings were fucked and rusted.

Unless you've become an 18 year old Slovak female I very much doubt it.

Besides, it was before the forum existed.

I look good in drag!

Even a lot of makeup won't give your face a typically-slovakian face structure.

What are you saying about my dancing foxy good looks?

When I met you, you looked neither like a fox, or like a typical Slovak.