Squats and deadlift numbers, corelationship with max watt output

over head press.

After a bit of reading the main difference is the shoulder press is seated and over head press is standing. It also seems to be the consensus that you'll lift more doing a shoulder press than OHP.

Do you do it with a Barbell or dumbbells?

Jamie Staff's core workout as prescribed by his Team GB conditioning coach Mark Simpson.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/gallery/2009/jan/11/cycling-strength-training-jamie-staff#/?picture=341573583&index=0

http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/11/cycling-strength-training

[QUOTE=V-L;2870258]Shoulder Press:
80kg x 10 reps
85 x 10
90 x 10
then front shoulder press at
70 x 10
75 x 10
80 x 10
Then leg press at
110 x 10
115 x 10
120 x 10

Thats the circuit training that we are doing really, legs one day for cycling and arms the other for rugby

Those are pretty mental numbers. Are those on a machine?

How does it compare to OHP?[/QUOTE]

Mental in the respect that he's shoulder pressing 90kg but only leg pressing 120?

Just because someone in Team GB once did some situps doesn't mean they are the most effective use of training time/recovery for everyone riding track. I can say that comfortably, even though I dont ride track. Because it is basic common sense.

Hang on, you're the only person to have mentioned sit ups so far. And I also don't remember ever saying that core work should be done at the detriment of anything else.

FYI, I train/race/coach/talk with a lot of track cyclists (of all levels) who do gym work, they all have slightly different programs as you would expect depending on their specifics. However, most (if not all) regularly do exercises such as plank, crunches and hanging leg raises alongside the "big" exercises like squat, deadlift and clean. If you want I can send their contact details and those of their coaches and you can explain your findings?
I've never yet heard of any of these riders being unable to train because of "sore abs" from core exercises, nor have I seen evidence to suggest that recovery is compromised by doing them as part of a structured training programme. Furthermore, there are many riders with very poor core strength who can benefit from such exercises even without the squat or DL (this is currently accepted knowledge published in British Cycling coaching resources and University course literature).
As you seem to be claiming (correct me if this is an assumption) that you are a strength and conditioning professional, I would have expected that you could quote your sources and provide some evidence to back up your stance, as it is so contrary to many currently accepted protocols.

Mental in the respect that he's shoulder pressing 90kg but only leg pressing 120?

I think there is some confusion actually, shoulder press for me is when I have a bar on my shoulders whist standing and squat down
Front press for me is the same except with the bar across my chest

Right, what you have described as a shoulder press is a rear squat, and your chest press = front squat. The figures make much more sense now. I was thinking anyone shoulder pressing 90kg for 10 would be a bit of a unit and leg press more than 120 (:

You might try mixing up weight and reps, some days try an extra 20kg for 6 reps, or 10-20 kg less for 16-20 reps. You could also try lifting at different tempo (the speed you complete the lift)...

I don't want to offer you too much advice as there are people on this thread with far greater knowledge than myself..

@V-L - are they full squats (to parallel or lower)?

@DFP - your line about sit-ups was the best thing I've read on here all week, thanks.

I've cut right back now on the free weights, as I want to be more rested before my big Sunday ride (not really training for anything, although keeping a couple of 'systems' ticking over for 2 types of event later in the year potentially). I still like them as a weekly conditioning thing, and to maintain useful muscle mass on my thighs (genetically it hangs around on my hamstrings and glutes even if neglected, but my quads atrophy). It's also a form of cheap health insurance for ageing bastards.

Totally minimal. Even with warm-up sets, I'm done in about 15 minutes (between getting home from work and having dinner), and then after allowing my meal to go down, I'm fresh enough to do a high resistance glycolytic thing on the turbo. This is usually on a Thursday.

I also invented an entirely new and event-specific barbell exercise last year, but it's a secret, and furthermore, no-one really cares about any of this shit.

@V-L - are they full squats (to parallel or lower)?

Yes of course

Well thank fuck for that.

Thread closed?

It's a loose thread that just keeps unravelling, rendering the participants more and more exposed.

well I was just looking for comparative watt bike data from other people on the forum

So ye, one of the main reasons I do the olympic press is for a strong core/hips. I do it pretty much how Rippetoe advises. Why would I need more core work? I deadlift without a belt before my leg press sets. I could do ab crunches every morning but why bother.
core work is usefull to fix a strength imbalance. If someone went from a program with leg presses and seated shoulder press to barbell squats and standing presses theyd have a weak link that would need fixing

Best thread ever...

this is kind of related. just stumbled upon it.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m485271rqA1rtcwbno1_1280.gif

wish my calfs were like that

Glad my glutes aren't though!

wish my calfs were like that

Orange?

Just ask an Essex girl how they do it.

-.-

There was a study by some Scottish institute on Hoys 1RM Squat and his kilo time.

There was a clear correlation between the two.

However, obviously Hoy just didn't squat in his training programme so it could of been the other things he did improved the kilo time as well.

In much the same way that Jamie did his PB 1rm squat in his strength training phase leading up to the 2008 games where he did his fastest ride (and I believe, produced his highest wattage).

To address the OP, for an amateur or unsupported rider, there's no useful correlation between these two any more than knowing that you are improving your strength which 'should', when followed with an appropriate period of plyometric gym work and then a taper, therefore improve your P/O. Obviously, as Miles says, other training factors have as much, if not more, of a bearing.

If you're PB'ing in the gym, be pleased that your strength training is effective. But that's only one piece of the jigsaw so don't look for formulas or predictions for what might/might not happen down the line, just ensure that the other periods/training goals are met and that weaknesses* are addressed with appropriate action.

*by this I mean aspects of your riding which may not be as good as others, such as flexibility or tactics.

Yes of course

On the basis that you call a back squat a shoulder press and a front squat a front press I could see why someone might jump to the conclusion that your form isn't entirely spot on.