Old and new Campy 10 speed compatibility

Ok - so internet dredges have so far only told me about compatibility of 10 speed shifters with 11 speed mech etc. Not interested in that..

I'm running 10 speed record currently, the rear mech has developed some play and misses one shift, I can't see what I can do to overhaul it and it most likely needs replacing - I can't afford a new £250 Record mech - so the question is:

will I be able to use a 2010/11 Centaur (or similar) with the 2008 10spd shifters?

Yes.

yes

• thread ends -
  

(thanks) x

Oh, and will there be any discernible difference? Other than the weight gain and loss of bling I will suffer

No.

Fantastic. Drinks on me etc.

Not sure what you mean by 'developed some play'.

The rear mech is a fairly simple piece of machinery, not sure what could have gone wrong in it, maybe spring tension or something?

Essentially there is more play side-to-side than there should be, which means that indexing is a bitch and that the mech doesn't move far enough to shift between the 2nd and 3rd sprocket, which means that by the time it gets to the 9th sprocket there isn't another 'shift' left to move it into the 10th. Does that explain?

It may be that it just needs a spring replacing but the mechanics I've shown it to didn't have any solution except "replace it".. then again they were all in mid Wales and it was the first time they'd seen a non-mountainbike in years - let alone one running campag.

I'll show you next time we're on a club ride dommy.

I thought the 2011 10-speed mechs (new logos) went over to the same cable pull as 11-speed? 2010 have the same pull.

oh really?

Looking at the Campag website, it's clouded in Campag-speak but in the tech specs is this matrix:

http://www.campagnolo.com/repository/documenti/en/errata_corrige.pdf

And that indicates that 2010 10-speed rear mechs (CE-VE) only work with 2010 10-speed ergolevers. Also, in the 2011 gruppo announcement, it says of the 10-speed rear mechs "The design is derived directly from the 11-speed components".

That's about it as far as I can definitively find on their site.

I'll see if I can find out anything more definitive - too cold and wet to go out tonight. I don't want to lead anyone up the wrong path.

And you wonder why fixed gears are popular? :)

Campag is a nightmare sometimes.

I think my shifters etc are 2008, so that would mean I couldn't use 2011 10spd, but could use 2010 10spd .... right?! :/

Well, a 2010 would definitely fit, can't find anything completely definitive - but did see a 2011 mech on a website that said it was compatible.

Who knows now...

9-10-11 speed Campag use the same hubs, so I can't see why 9-10-11 mechs would not be interchangeable.

isn't it to do with the increments of cable pull? Hubs are just a width? 9 and ten use the same over width, just the shift increments are different

I thought the 2011 10-speed mechs (new logos) went over to the same cable pull as 11-speed? 2010 have the same pull.

I can't even begin to get my head around why you think this would be the case? The spacing between 10-speed and 11-speed is different, so they must have different amounts of cable pull, otherwise you'd never get the gears to index properly.

As I understand it, all 10 speed components are compatible with one another. I've got 2010 Centaur levers, in the new shape, working with a 2006 (or maybe earlier) Centaur rear mech without any issues.

isn't it to do with the increments of cable pull? Hubs are just a width? 9 and ten use the same over width, just the shift increments are different

Yes. The hub splining for 9-10-11 is the same, so you can fit a 9 speed, 10 speed or 11 speed cassette on the same hub. The rear mech compatibility is absolutely to do with cable pull and the width between sprockets is different for each of 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes.

The spacing between 10-speed and 11-speed is different, so they must have different amounts of cable pull, otherwise you'd never get the gears to index properly.

Not if the actuation ratio of the mech was different.

The 2011 10 speed mechs look more like the 2011 mechs, apparently the new design is 'better'. What it does mean though is that they are supposedly only compatible with 2011 shifters. So if that's the case and the cable pull is the same on 2011 10 speed and 11 speed, the actuation ratio on the mechs must be different.

Also, the new 2011 10sp shifters are all 'Power shift' - 3-up and 1 down shifting.

It seems to get worse every damn year.

Having said all that, I have just read about people using an 11 speed rear mech and 11 speed chain on an all 10 speed setup and it working well....

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=81901

now that is interesting. I can get a Record 11spd RD for £120 new..

Question is: I'm doing London to Paris next week - I probably shouldn't be fucking around with this stuff right now should I? Might just stick to my "9 speed" system thats working until I come back

I've got 2012 shifters working with a 2010 cassette no problem, 10 speed, even with a jimmyied 9 speed shimano mtb mech. If everything is 10 speed campag you should have no problems at all as it would be pointless to change the cable pull of the shifters, space beween the cogs and derailer leverage.

it would be pointless to change the cable pull of the shifters, space beween the cogs and derailer leverage.

To any sane person yes. But this is Campagnolo.

problem over - took it to see a proper mechanic today and he fixed it in 4 mins. Of course it was some crazy 'trick' that "all mechanics know for those shifters" but isn't in the confusing campag manuals or on the internet.. and also requires the use of a third hand.

Camp-arg!-nolo!

There is still some play in it, so will need to be replaced in the future but for now it rolls on.

FWIW both the mechanics I spoke to today (condor, and specialized concept store) told me that the old 10 speed record is much much better manufactured than the new stuff.

Is the new stuff made in the same place as the old stuff, or have they moved production somewhere "more affordable"?