Cyclist kills motorist

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-13647541

This might have been posted before, but I couldn't find anything on it. In summary he punched a motorist for opening his car door in front of him, motorist subsequently died and cyclist went to jail for 18 months. Pretty shocking.

cyclist? or just some schlep on a BSO?

Looks like a schlep on a bike to me. Prob had his car re-possesed and had to resort to cycling to his dealers house. Allegedly...

But if the chap had died due to injuries sustained when he hit the car door, would the driver have had more than a light admonishment?

But if the chap had died due to injuries sustained when he hit the car door, would the driver have had more than a light admonishment?

accident vs assault though

Self defence?

In any case, unless you're prepared to do the time, don't punch people dude.

yeah, if he'd been walking he wouldn't have been known as 'pedestrian' etc etc

Self defence?

In any case, unless you're prepared to do the time, don't punch people dude.

Retaliation for a passed potential injury is hardly self defence. That being said, all of us (well, I know I do) see red sometimes and it's an absolute shame that passions like this can result in these kinds of incidents.

yeah, if he'd been walking he wouldn't have been known as 'pedestrian' etc etc

He was called a cyclist because being on a bike at the time is directly related to why the incident occurred. If the car jumped onto the pavement and almost ran into him, I'm pretty sure they would have been referred to as a pedestrian in the news story.

accident vs assault though

Commision vs ommision?

oh yeah, I forgot the bike bit

But if the chap had died due to injuries sustained when he hit the car door, would the driver have had more than a light admonishment?

Probably not, no. But then it's not quite the same thing is it? That would have been entirely an accident, whereas punching someone is very deliberate. Though that's not to say a light admonishment would be appropriate.

Alleged accidental door opening at a cyclist.

Alleged accidental door opening at a cyclist.

very difficult to prove intent though. He's paid a fairly steep price anyway as have his family etc

"shouldn't have been riding so close to parked cars"
vs
"should look out for cyclists when opening car door"
?

Probably not, no. But then it's not quite the same thing is it? That would have been entirely an accident, whereas punching someone is very deliberate. Though that's not to say a light admonishment would be appropriate.

I agree, punching someone is clearly very deliberate, whereas dooring someone is clearly a result of not paying attention to what you are doing.

If not paying attention to what you are doing results in someones death then that's clearly a bad thing, but in the (entirely theoretical) case of "death by dooring" I reckon the driver of the car would get off without any real sanction.

This is based on nothing but my prejudice, that said.

I agree, punching someone is clearly very deliberate, whereas dooring someone is clearly a result of not paying attention to what you are doing.

If not paying attention to what you are doing results in someones death then that's clearly a bad thing, but in the (entirely theoretical) case of "death by dooring" I reckon the driver of the car would get off without any real sanction.

This is based on nothing but my prejudice, that said.

I guess it becomes a question of what you believe prison is for. Is it there to rehabilitate or is it there to punish (or, as we see more and more in both the UK and the US, is it there to get people who are deemed socially problematic off the streets and out of our minds)?

I can imagine someone accidentally killing a cyclist by dooring them, and a prison term being the least of their worries. Having to live with that guilt for the rest of their life would probably be pretty shitty.

"shouldn't have been riding so close to parked cars"
vs
"should look out for cyclists when opening car door"
?

I've been doored twice. Both times the cars were stationary in traffic jams as I filtered.

There's not a lot you can do to avoid this except ride at 5mph.

Fair point, although the news story says the cyclists swerved to avoid the door, so I reckon there was room. There's also sometimes the option of filtering on the right, but I often find myself in a pickle when I do that.
It was just a ponderance anyway.

Good point about staying right when filtering in a jam. There's less chance of the driver jumping out than a passenger!

That said on both occasions there was another lane of traffic (heading the same direction) to the right. So I'd have been on someone else's LHS.

sigh

I've been doored twice. Both times the cars were stationary in traffic jams as I filtered.

There's not a lot you can do to avoid this except ride at 5mph.

So ride at 5mph.

I do thank you.

Good point about staying right when filtering in a jam. There's less chance of the driver jumping out than a passenger!

That said on both occasions there was another lane of traffic (heading the same direction) to the right. So I'd have been on someone else's LHS.

sigh

filtering on the right you get reactive/angry u-turns... saying that I'll still use the right while filtering as it gives more options but just depends on the road you're on at the time

"shouldn't have been riding so close to parked cars"
vs
"should look out for cyclists when opening car door"
?

The issue is that the guy on the bike punched the driver out of sheer anger for not looking first/provoked or not, and however careless the driver might have been, assaulting someone is always a low thing to do.

I've been doored twice. Both times the cars were stationary in traffic jams as I filtered.

There's not a lot you can do to avoid this except ride at 5mph.

Me too. Worst one was going downhill quite fast (15mph, say) down the cycle lane on the left. Van passenger door swung open and I went straight into it. I was riding a semi recumbent at the time, which weighs a hell of a lot, so the door of the van was very damaged. So was my knee though.

Self defence?

No.

In any case, unless you're prepared to do the time, don't punch people dude.

Punching someone once in the face wouldn't usually result in "time".

Thin skull rule.

Mens rea automatically assumed when you throw a punch as it's intended to cause bodily harm.

That the guy unluckily died from just one punch is not a defence.

He was lucky to get only 18 months.