Marathon 2011 -alert-alert-alert-

Hope this info is useful...

It's not unprecedented for bike rides to proceed ahead of a popular* City Marathon

http://www.wolverhamptoncitymarathon.co.uk/marathon-history/

Cycle event - appeals particularly to families. The cycle event has grown beyond expectations and is now one of the most popular events.
Maybe LFGSS could work with the London organisers to look at the model used in W'hampton, with a view to replicating this in the future in London. Get Boris involved** or something.

*the race not the city

** only kidding

Whatever happens between now and the day will have no influence whatsoever on any decision to allow us to ride on the route after the road closures this year. They simply will not allow it. Last time, the second group were stopped and booted off course at Cannon Street by the police due to safety issues. This instruction will already be in place and agreed at a far higher level than we will reach at this time. It's also unfair to blame Billy for posting the thread early, as this will have been discussed after last years ride.

Night ride or nothing I'm afraid.

+1. The Marathon is a world renowned event. They are not going to add any potential risk by allowing us onto closed roads, so close to the departure of the elite runners.

Maybe they'd let a SKY ride run just ahead of the Virgin London marathon.

hmm maybe not.

you are all in dreamland

If we send someone to speak to the organisers and the relevant authorities with a plan of how this could proceed, ie. with serious restrictions, it would be too late for this one anyway. The likelihood of making the whole route would be impossible too as, if we had to be off the route by a certain time, it would involve riding on the open roads south of the Thames which they could never give approval to in any official capacity.

It's still worth having the dialogue for future rides as you never know what you can achieve. Hmmm, where's big Bozza's phone number.....

Olympic marathon ride anyone? Let's get the list going early.

1. Haile Gebrselassie
   

So, if Nick Bitel has any sense he will be keeping an eye on this thread.

I for one would be very interested to hear his response to some of the ideas postulated here.

I don't think we need to do it the night before, we just need to do it before the roads are closed. So leave the start at 5am, and we will be round before 7.

Open roads, we have every right to be there. Where's the problem?

I think it's so much better than the night before, as that will just be some random night ride.

sadly i can't see what motivation there is for them to allow us to ride in the morning, even if we have appointed front and back marshalls and no sprinting etc.

i know it would be perfectly safe and just a lovely, joyous ride but there's no reason for the organisers of something huge like Ldn marathon to sanction another event which they are not in control of and does interact with their space and people.

:(

sad times

edit: written before john^^ i meant in the morning on the closed roads where the marathon has some jurisdiction. i would be up for a hella early morning ride

Now the cat is out of the bag, I'm for negotiating with the London marathon to see how this can be resolved in the future. Marathon ride is a special thing and we should make best efforts to keep it alive for next year and beyond.
Negotition is preferable to just saying fuck it. I'm not a fan of the evening option, it's the early morning start, the swish past the volunteers, the empty roads and the attempt to sprint down the mall that make it fun and special. If that is taken away then it's just another rumble through london's famous london's streets.
Negotiation entails restictions being placed upon us and this ride in particular and will probably require us to police ourselves, sign some sort of legal waiver, possibly take out insurance to cover volunteers etc, and also make sure that some of the sketchy riding that we overlook on our big rides doesn't occur/is frowned upon/stamped out - delete as applicable.
But this might be a watershed moment when we as a group of cyclists engage with the authorities to see if we can't come to arrangement that keeps both sides happy.
Has someone spoken to Jacqui and teddy about what they have to do to keep the tweed run legal and aboveboard and seen what elements of that we can take forward to keep the marathon run alive in the form we know and enjoy...

I think there are many other cyclists that try to take advantage of this time to hit the empty roads.

You will need to think of them. I saw groups of plucky individuals last year.

Negotiations should consider this. Otherwise, 500 tickets to be shared across the whole of the Marathon ride.

in the future yes, it can be done but needs to be done properly i think

the last three years we (school) have organised a 5k fun run in regents park. albeit at a different scale to what is planned for the marathon ride, but we have to tick alot of boxes for them (royal parks) to even consider our event involving 200 runners lasting 3 hours. public safety being the main issues, but we arrange everything from set up, marshalls, first aid, clean up

I really can't see why organisers / authorities would object to a marathon ride just prior to the race when the road closures are all set. how the forum control numbers and deals with unforeseen issues is another matter.

This year is a dead duck, fact. If someone is willing to put the effort into negotiations with the organisers, and we're talking some serious effort here, then this ride may take place again in a muted form. Unfortunately we don't have history on our side. The first one interfered with the wheelchair event and last years was so big it pissed everyone off who was trying to keep the route clear. I'd personally make you pay blood to gain permission to ride the course and these guys do this for a living. You may get a half marathon as you could get everyone off the course in time, but I still don't ever think you'll have a mass sprint down The Mall again*. Kind of misses the point somewhat.

Best suggestion right now is for Billy/VB to close the thread and perhaps start a new one for the night ride. Beyond that, arrange any negotiation panel via pm and take it forward away from this thread.

*unless you do it at night.

There were a lot of real Police around in the last 10 miles or so. It's a very easy route to block so wouldn't imagine you'd get very far beyond Tower Bridge on the actual course if they didn't want you there.

Has someone spoken to Jacqui and teddy about what they have to do to keep the tweed run legal and aboveboard and seen what elements of that we can take forward to keep the marathon run alive in the form we know and enjoy...

My sentiments exactly. Until this is resolved I'm out (and feeling a little sheepish about my previous comments). We did have a police escort at on point though (year before last) so I think the coal-face guys would be happy to help, it's just the boardroom dudes you need to chat up.

Note: this was (3 years prior) my first ever LFGSS ride (on a langster f*ckyeah!) so has a sweet spot in my heart. Would love to be it again but not if it's outgrown margin for safety.

Closed roads are closed to all traffic, and as Oliver will remind you we are traffic. There is a strong police presence on the route and as the organisers are monitoring this thread you must expect them to be ready for us.

Also there could be implications for LFGSS if it is seen as being the organising party.

But this might be a watershed moment when we as a group of cyclists engage with the authorities to see if we can't come to arrangement that keeps both sides happy.
Has someone spoken to Jacqui and teddy about what they have to do to keep the tweed run legal and aboveboard and seen what elements of that we can take forward to keep the marathon run alive in the form we know and enjoy...

^this. this community is now huge and yes some of us dont live in London. but i for one would love to ride around it and am willing to get up at stupidaclock to do so if there was a possibility we could do it on closed roads of some sort. Maybe its about time the forum began these types of conversation as a matter of course. Its not as fun as doing it guerilla style but the chance to do it at all outweighs that.

VB have you had any answer to the question of co-operation?

No communication from them today, and I haven't seen the account that I know they are using online.

Closed roads are closed to all traffic, and as Oliver will remind you we are traffic.

Not necessarily, it depends on what the order is for. On the London Marathon, I'd suspect that the order would include all vehicular traffic apart from organising vehicles. Spectators on foot are obviously allowed to walk along the footways, etc.

At any rate, however the order might be framed, in this particular case it is not lawful to cycle along these streets at these times.

There is a strong police presence on the route and as the organisers are monitoring this thread you must expect them to be ready for us.

Also there could be implications for LFGSS if it is seen as being the organising party.
Yes, people just need to accept that the idea is dead, and that the organisers would have taken this step in any case even had the thread not been posted in advance.

Be happy that you managed to do it once and move on. One thing I've observed is that for some events people want to do them again and again, or annually, etc. I think that's always going to happen, but come on, we've got plenty of ride ideas, old and new, and there's no better and more varied place for organising them than London. Let's just do them, and let's not worry too much about whether we'll do it again next year.

Not necessarily, it depends on what the order is for. On the London Marathon, I'd suspect that the order would include all vehicular traffic apart from organising vehicles. Spectators on foot are obviously allowed to walk along the footways, etc.

At any rate, however the order might be framed, in this particular case it is not lawful to cycle along these streets at these times.

Yes, people just need to accept that the idea is dead, and that the organisers would have taken this step in any case even had the thread not been posted in advance.

Be happy that you managed to do it once and move on. One thing I've observed is that for some events people want to do them again and again, or annually, etc. I think that's always going to happen, but come on, we've got plenty of ride ideas, old and new, and there's no better and more varied place for organising them than London. Let's just do them, and let's not worry too much about whether we'll do it again next year.

i think you also have the problem that people dont want the mass skyride style event, but instead something faster for 200 or so cyclists which just isnt feasible in london.

its the situation where there is too much interest for it to be deemed safe enough during the set up (as in previous years), and not enough people for it to be a ride in its own right.

good to see that our marathon planner has got the 'long-game' in mind. We wouldn't want to rush into anything and promote cycling, say, in the present.

I mentioned 5 years down the line because by that time (if we don't provoke a reaction) the 'no bikes' instructions may have been forgotten and some people can do it 'guerilla' style as with the first ride.

Basically: What Oliver said.

Agree with Skully, making this public was a major fail. Small, quick, lawless ride, answerable to no one, if it goes tits up, SCATTER! We're responsible cyclists but not saints.

Agree with Skully, making this public was a major fail. Small, quick, lawless ride, answerable to no one, if it goes tits up, SCATTER! We're responsible cyclists but not saints.

Or if something goes really bad you can take a copper hostage, worked for me in the past, that time when I fell behind on the Bridges Run.

Or if something goes really bad you can take a copper hostage, worked for me in the past, that time when I fell behind on the Bridges Run.

And now you're happily married and expecting your first child. Such a lovely story.