Araya clinchers

what I meant about the student becoming the master is that the japanese framebuilder become the master.

take Nagasawa for instance, he grab the chance to study the italian bicycles (mostly cinelli) took them apart, rode them etc. before deciding that he want to become a framebuilder and study in Italy, before he went back to Japan and make his own frame, hence he master were the Italian, now it's the japanese.

Oh,that's why puts the Italian flag along side the Japanese flag on his frames.Did'nt know that.Thanks for that info.