To all Bob Jackson owners....

... could I ask a little favour, please?

I'm pretty much decided on getting a Vigorelli now, but would like to try one for size. I'm 6' 2", so I guess I'm after a 59cm.

Does anyone have a 58-60 that I could try out, please?

BJ and vigorelli's are chalk and cheese. a BJ will be a little flexy and nice ride, the vigorelli will be alu that is stiff and harsh???!?!? sounds like you're making the decision purely on aesthetics.

isn't bj's vigorelli lugged steel?

i think he means a Bob Jackson Vigorelli track frame, not a Cinelli...

never heard of BJ vigorelli, only cinelli vigorelli

haha! dale got pwned.

there's another of them cinelli vigorelli's on the ebizzle.

what fucktard company would have the same name as another?!?

I do mean a Bob Jackson Vigorelli, and they are steel. I've heard lots of good things from people about them.

the ones i've ridden are very very flexy through the BB area, PJ's moves out 1cm side to side when you track stand. saying that my dave yates in 531 moves around a bit as well. modern 531 isn't as good as old 531, or it could just be the lugs/BB shell?!?

Understandable coz no one ever calls them vigorelli's, only BJ's.. but dogs still deserves to suffer for his rookie mistake as he so often pulls me up on shit!
Carry on!

I said CARRY ON! :P

hippy, BTW what size valves for a HED 3???

Mercian are Vigorelli too, aren't they?

it's a Velodrome in Italia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velodromo_Vigorelli

Vigorelli's are Mercian, Cinelli are Olympic or Supercorsa and BJ's are Blowjobs...

trampsparadise BJ's are Blowjobs...

As are Pompinos...

I'm 6' 2" and have a 60.1cm BJ.

It's too large.

Go for a 58cm frame.

Oh, and you can try mine... it will have to be next week sometime as I appear to have parties every moment until Monday.

velocity boy I'm 6' 2" and have a 60.1cm BJ.

It's too large.

Go for a 58cm frame.

I'm 6'4" and have a 64cm BJ. It's the right size.

Think bike sizing is a bit more complex than that ;) and it depends on more than just height. I would humbly suggest that a 58cm frame for someone who is 6'2" is likely to be too small. Remember that horizontal TT frames used to be sized by a fistful of seatpost for a reason. People got a slightly smaller track frame, but not by much, and that was for track racing rather than riding in traffic.

The orangutang styled bikes are ripped on Bike Snob for a reason...

dogsballs hippy, BTW what size valves for a HED 3???

I don't own one. Why not look at yours and see what fits?

hippy [quote]dogsballs hippy, BTW what size valves for a HED 3???

I don't own one. Why not look at yours and see what fits?[/quote]

Just drill it out:)

Anyway, you should be able to use long valves in HED3s. Isn't the space under the sticker big enough for a long valve tube?
If that is the case, then it still makes more sense buying long valve to deal with HED and DeepV rather than mixing and matching.

dogsballs the ones i've ridden are very very flexy through the BB area, PJ's moves out 1cm side to side when you track stand. saying that my dave yates in 531 moves around a bit as well. modern 531 isn't as good as old 531, or it could just be the lugs/BB shell?!?

it does flex, that's why it is so lovely and rides like a dream, but possibly is not as extreme as dale thinks, but then again, he doesn't know what a vigorelli is so i'd take his anitpodean opinions with a pinch of salt. (joke) It's a 57/8, i'm 6" 2, it fits perfectly and because of the horizontal top tube they come up big. Dave is right, Momentum is wrong. if you come to polo on sunday you can have a go.

pj

it does flex, that's why it is so lovely and rides like a dream

Damn right - they're a beautiful ride.

It's a 57/8, i'm 6" 2, it fits perfectly and because of the horizontal top tube they come up big. Dave is right, Momentum is wrong.

No I'm right and your're wrong - this is fun isn't it?

The whole point of my post is that you can't say what size bike someone should have only on the basis of their height. You need to look at what their leg, torso and arm measurements are; how flexible they are; how they're going to ride; how far they and fast they're going to ride. Otherwise ordering a custom bike would be as simple as telling the builder your height. Your 57/58 might fit you but it sure as fuck wouldn't fit me and I'm 6'4", so only a bit taller.

Btw, what does "because of the horizontal top tube they come up big" mean? If they had a sloping top tube then you should look at the effective top tube measurement (ie the equivalent horizontal top tube) when deciding which size you need.

Here are pictures of my two bikes. One's 64 c-t and one 60 c-t. Do you think either of these are too big for me?

Here's my Brooklyn Jack Crank's custom Witcomb - notice how little seatpost is showing. That's what a horizontal top tube bike shouild look like. You see quite a few fixed gears on the internet that are way too small for their owners.

Sparky ... could I ask a little favour, please?

I'm pretty much decided on getting a Vigorelli now, but would like to try one for size. I'm 6' 2", so I guess I'm after a 59cm.

Does anyone have a 58-60 that I could try out, please?

I'd recommend going to http://www.wrenchscience.com or competitive cyclist and using their fit calculator to get an idea of what size you need. then call BJ and ask about TT lengths of the different Vigorellis. They can feel big in terms of standover if you size them by just the seat tube because they have high BBs.

i'm always right, except when i'm wrong.

but yes, i know what you're saying. i think you may be being a bit angry/mardy ('this is fun isn't it?', 'it sure as fuck wouldn't fit me', 'That's what a horizontal top tube bike shouild look like') but i can't tell and if so don't really want to start cocksizing over bike sizes.

i have a vague belief that people 'as a rule', especially when starting out, tend to go for bikes that are too big for them. this is why i offer this advice. all of this is negated by the vagaries of bike sizing, and if you have a deformed torso and arms longer than your legs you may need slightly different dimensions.

older style path frames tend to be easier to size, even if it is in imperial, because of the traditional geometry. the whole seatpost thing is a bit redundant if you're not riding a bike on the track anyway. my bob jackson comes up BIG. it looks BIG. it's a 57/8. oh and i can't see your pictures at work, but your bikes look too big for you, that's for sure.