Dave Yates built frames (inc Joe Waugh, custom Condor, Paris, Pearson...)

Hi @DaveYates you confirmed my 90’s Condor was one of yours but when you have time I would be interested to know a bit more about the use of 531 designer select please. Have read a few bits online but any reason to use this over other my popular 531 variations or just down to the original customers preference?
My frame is quiet large 62cm and have seen similar sized frames in DS was wondering if frame size influenced the use of DS?

Thanks!

Dave replied via email rather than in the thread, as such it bounced to my email as email > posting isn't a feature of the forum.

It's a great reply though, so... here I am posting on behalf of DaveYates.

Hi Lampman
The DS decal was intoduced after requests by me and other builders to cover proper custom frames. 531 C and St were the standard sets sold by Reynolds the the world and his dog !! Proper custom builders rarely built sets, we wanted something that set us apart from the likes of Raleigh, Dawes etc that built standard frames. It saved a lot of "Why is your 531c frame twice the price of a Raleigh built from the same tubes?" The theory was the DS decals were only issued to custom builders. Personally, I never built "sets" all my custom frames were built on the premise of each frame tube selected to do the best job. If that meant choosing a heavier or lighter tube from the Reynolds range then that was what I did. Your frame is largish so probably used a heavier down tube. I frequently mixed makes of tubes to get the best fit for the job. All my personal frames were built from allsorts, hence the decal I had made

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omg that decal is amazing

Thanks @Velocio and thanks @daveyates for such a detailed reply, has made my day tbh.

Interesting regarding the down tube, I always presumed similar for the seat tube as my frame takes 27.0 seat post.

Love the decal as well!

This decal is too cool

OK so now this thread is really starting to take shape. The All-Sorts decal is pretty funny.

I feel like there could be a nice Liquorice All Sorts / Reynolds Iron Pipes tribute T Shirt in this

I’ve just come into possession of a beautifully panto’d @DaveYates 631 bike. Serial number 9993 as far as I can make out. Would you have any info on this please? Trying it out in London tomorrow. Thanks! T

Got this the other month. Almost new. Changed the front mech (bottom pull now) and brakes to NOS lx to match. Swapped out the stem for fit and have some bars coming today. Will be good to get it ridden.

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• s-l1200.webp

Hi Tom
9993 is a Super Randonneur model built in 631 3/12/98 for a chap called Richardson. Sorry, thats all the info I have on this one. Dont know what you mean by "panto'd" would you care to translate in case I come across the term again? You are talking to a dinosaur here 😉😁😁

Panto = pantograph. Engraving on tops of forks, lugs, seat stay caps, bottom bracket. Usually a logo or name. Frames and components

Colnago engraved on seat stay caps etc. I think there was even a Pantografia.

For a giggle Google polish panto butcher :)

Strictly speaking, aren't BB shells, seat stay caps and lugs cast with logos rather than pantoed?

True, Big manufacturers can get their own frame components made with their names / logos on them.

Smaller outfits took OEM components and had them engraved.

Just bought a DY Wayfarer - frame number looks like 11943

@DaveYates what info would you have on it?

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Many thanks Dave, really appreciated. I done 30 miles on it yesterday around London and it was amazing. Super comfy and responsive and it’s not even set up with nice components. I’m looking forward to sorting it out and putting lots more miles on it. Hope you’re well and thanks again. T

It's always been just "engraving" 😉

No, the builder takes a standard item, takes it to an engraver and gets him (or her) to engrave required letters or symbols. The big manufacturers of mass produced frames sometimes had the stuff cast in, but the result was always very rough and not worthy of a "proper" builder.

Sorry, the order books are unavailable until next week. I will get your info then.

Glad to see it's still going strong

Nice, thanks

Thanks Dave, much appreciated-have a great weekend!

Interesting would the Condor frames you built be engraved or cast?

As a taller rider i've always had a soft spot for the what I believe is called the Freuler geometry where the top tube is dropped a bit on big frames.
Ive noticed a few of your builds use this and if not to inconvenient I would be very interested to please hear your thoughts on this geometry, is it something you recommended for taller riders or customer preference etc and why? @DaveYates
Thanks.

Urs Freuler was a tall rider in an era of compact frames. The extensions were to keep the frame / seat / cockpit combo stiff iirc.

All the Condor lugged frames were cast, engraved. They were all custom builds so each one was unique. Usual procedure was they designed the frame ie main dimensions, sent us an order form with any variations in the model spec, we built it, painted it and sent it off. Occaisionally I added input for some frames eg the team jobs. All our own custom frames were ground upwards designs in consultation with the customer usually taking a couple of hours. The dropped top tube style just made sense for larger frames.

Thanks for the info! @DaveYates @midlife

Chapeau! @DaveYates, Sir.
Great privilege to have you here.
Any recollection of this ?
I bought the frame in Yarm few years back. The former owner was a Roughstuff Fellowship member.
It was originally built for Arai drag brake. I’ve added the cantilever bosses myself 🫣.
It has really lovely chromed Suntour ends, high BB, and generous fork rake.
I love it

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