That Starmer fella...

This is hilarious. Why is it a quote? Is that the best election slogan they could find from Starmer?

Marina Hyde on top form this morning: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/07/humiliation-hartlepool-smalltown-detective-di-starmer

I'm not by any stretch arguing that there aren't also cultural dimensions to class, by the way, but the contortion of the term 'working class' to mean older adult male with socially conservative views has been hugely damaging to political discourse.

Just to be clear, are you saying that the contortion you refer to is an inaccurate one perpetuated by more progressive types (i.e., your average metropolitan liberal elite) or an actual shift in the demographic of those who self-identify as working class?

Strong work from Rayner on those boots

I don't know who any of them are

That is a good summary of this thread.

Peston saying this result suggests another decade of Tory rule is super depressing

Decade? Lol, they’re gonna rule in perpetuity.

A bit of both, really—the term 'working class' is used by many of the commentariat to describe a particular type of person; those people may well identify as working class, but for purposes of political analysis they might more reasonably be placed in a different category dependent on their material circumstances. These material circumstances might more effectively explain these people's voting behaviours than a limited and reductive definition of 'working class'.

Again, I don't want to deny people's identities as such—there are obviously more dimensions to class than just the economic.

On the second point, I guess there has been a shift of sorts. Older generations of working class people who grew up in and around the labour movement will have different conceptions of class consciousness than younger people who are subject to similar, albeit different, labour market pressures in the present day. This (mostly) younger generation of workers who largely aren't homeowners in some cases might not consider themselves working class, in spite of the fact that materially speaking this is the role they inhabit. Of course, this is complicated—if you're from a middle class background you don't simply 'become' working class by virtue of your position in the labour market at any given moment, but still I would argue that these material circumstances are very important to consider, and are often effaced by the narrow definition of 'working class' that is so prevalent.

Sorry for the long and probably inconclusive post! I also don't think a relatively simple material analysis such as this can explain on its own why the result in Hartlepool was so bad.

Anyway - the rest of the results also look fucking awful for Labour so far, so I don't expect Starmer to last long now. Time for Nandy or Raynor probably.

I think that'd be way premature. Corbyn got to lose two general elections before he got tanked. Starmer should get at least one. Though I agree these results are fucking awful.

Hartlepool voted for what they think is good for their town and they are right in thinking that having a Tory MP is going to bring investment and attention. If they had voted for a Labour MP while labour sits as opposition, nothing would have changed for them, maybe Tories would have made it worse to make sure they vote Tory next time round, wrong to blame the voters here.

ALWAYS wrong to blame the voters. You don't win the argument by scolding people.

White laces. Going for the NF vote.

Does that mean Tories are now forced to occupy more of the middle ground and just become a racist Labour party?

Same goes for Greens; if Tories become green I can see them ruling for next 50 years. A racist Green party would do wonders in the UK.

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Should’ve carved it in stone.

Think it's a bit patronising to assume that a picture of two people in a cafe is alien to part of the country, to be honest

Corbyn got to lose two general elections before he got tanked. Starmer should get at least one.

How many months did Corbyn get before his first internal leadership challenge? 9 months?

Is it a cafe? Looks like they’re doing shots to me.

lol!

Even more mass appeal then, surely...

Edit: from the colour liquids are they jaegerbombs?!

Yep, they’re ‘bombs. Perfect to get you going in the AM. Looks like Kier is down a few and she’s just doing it for the opp.

Whether you like it or not, Corbyn was immensely unpopular with the parliamentary party and, ultimately, the country. That’s why he was challenged.

Maybe just this once, rather than eating itself in yet another bout of infighting, the Labour Party should actually listen to voters, rather than scolding them, and come up with some policies that address people’s concerns?

^this

Looks like voters decided they wanted more of New Order’s messaging

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Also, voting Conservative is clearly aspirational, massive bungs to mates so if I flagshag enough and get friends with Tories then I could get a massive bung too