Car appreciation... the aesthetics, the engineering, etc

And they sheared the bolts off, the bastards.

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I'm hoping someone can point me in the direction of the "bible" for this sort of thing so I can start reading up and realise how foolish I am!

If you want a reasonable starter on suspension geometry then I'd recommend 'Competition Car Suspension' by Allan Staniforth. If you want the bible on suspension, then that would have to be Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by Milliken & Milliken, but it's pretty heavy going. I did A-level Maths, but I still find the mathematics in Milliken & Milliken pretty hard going. It's still the default go-to book on suspension, despite having been written 25 years ago.

The chassis is, relatively speaking, the easy part. It's basically just a big bracket holding all the working bits of the car together. If you use 1" square 16g ERW and plenty of triangulation then you won't go far wrong, preferably with semi-stressed aluminium panels attached with polyurethane adhesive and pop-rivets. Or carbon panels if you really want to go bling.

I've just ordered a copy of the Allan Staniforth book... £70 for a used one :(

Lordy. If you can cancel the order, you're welcome to borrow my copy for as long as you need it...

as long as you need it...

That could be a looong time 😂 I don't mind having my own copy to be honest!

Further investigation suggests a classic donor vehicle might be the easiest way to get around registration in Ireland which makes me think an NA MX-5 could be the one to go for unless I could happen upon a Lotus (or otherwise) 7 but I suspect they're making strong money and it would be a shame to chop one up...

NA Mx-5 chassis seems at a cursory glance to be fairly simple too (I think)...

NA Mx-5 chassis seems at a cursory glance to be fairly simple too (I think)...

On paper they make a lot of sense for the money too... double wishbones, discs, rwd, light-ish, massive aftermarket support.

I'd suggest working out what element you most want to be able to say "I've done that".

For e.g. if you use an MX5 donor for the chassis/suspension/engine/trans/steering/etc then it's a design, trimming, paint and bodywork project.

I'd suggest a resto-mod type project where you get to do some (but crucially not all) of each element of the car, which would give you some insight into which of these elements you actually enjoyed, and which you'd rather pay someone else to do.

Diving straight into a ground up, do-it-all project is going to be an enormous undertaking.

My suggestion: import a Volvo 242, convert to RHD, swap in the engine, transmission and running gear from an E90 M3.

That should take 3-4 years and by the end of it you'll have done a bit of everything, you can sell the car to me and start your new project.

you can sell the car to me and start your new project

I was wondering how I'd finance it 😉

I know what you mean regarding a restomod though, it's probably a bit more sensible for a first big project.

I can't help but feel like once the whole thing is broken down into it's constituent parts though there's no one element that's too daunting aside from the chassis and suspension design but looks like getting a license plate on the finished article in Ireland is going to be a nightmare unless there's a "donor" chassis with a VIN...

I've been working with a world class engine designer, and the owner of a race electronics company, for the past 3-4 years. We've been joined by the owner of a company that remanufactures these engines. Next year- year 5 - we hope to run one of these engines.

Open the pod bay doors Hal.
I’m sorry Dave. I’m afraid I can’t do that.

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Absolutely but I'm planning more along the lines of building an N/A K24 which is almost join the dots in comparison to what you're working on!

There's a pretty tried and tested formula for a built K24 thankfully!

https://youtu.be/uKbs4Yv3NvU

Cool

I'm sure those huge iPad style displays will become ubiquitous before long but I find them very jarring to the eye in a design sense... Especially when they aren't more integrated into the console, they look a bit plonked on...

I know what you mean but because there’s nothing else there (literally nothing) I think it works really well. Plenty of other cards with a traditional/legacy dash look shit with a giant tablet bolted on.

They will definitely become ubiquitous. So much more flexible than building a car with buttons.

Another software update this week tweaked the main UI with an overhauled driver display, ready for more fsd features. Can’t do that in any other brands car.

https://youtube.com/c/BuilderCreator

I follow and watch quite a bit of this guy on YouTube. He is doing exactly what you describe above, space frame, mid mount etc. Might be worth having a trawl through to see if the work he's doing is within what you think it would take?

Does it not get annoying? Pretty sure it has all the bells and whistles of dimming and adjusting, but fuck starting at a screen everytime you want to do something.

I also like buttons and dials. Buttons and dials are nice.

Same here. I loath touch screens in cars. There's a reason F1 steering wheels are festooned with switches and buttons, and not a touchscreen. Once you're used to the locations, pressing a physical switch doesn't need you to take your eyes off the road. The same is never true of a touchscreen. Not until they have haptic feedback.

Even with haptics you won't get the same level of ease you get with physical buttons.

It’s definitely not quite as easy. The swivel wheel on a BMW for example, is easier to use but it does have two wheels on the steering wheel that do most functions...

Left hand wheel:

Scroll - volume
Left / right - change track / radio station
Push- mute

Right hand wheel:

Scroll - cruise speed
Left / right - radar follow distance
Push - voice control

You’ve also got wipers, indicators, auto high beam, gears and cruise on the stalks.

Not sure what else you actually need whilst moving.

If there is anything, voice can do it.

In a recent episode of Bitchin Rides, they did that - carbon fibre moulds. Professional garage, loads of staff and it took weeks to get it done.

bodywork

No idea if it is feasible on something the size of a car, but a motorcycle YT I watch made bits of bodywork using SS wire welded to make a frame, then super glued cut up t-shirts to make the rough shape. Once that "soft" frame was made they painted resin on the fabric and then fibre glassed and filled properly over it all.

I used to work for a really small kit car firm in Kent, we did a car from scratch while I was there.

I designed a chassis for them made from 25x25 ERW box with tubular double wishbones - the chassis was a bit of a mash up of pre-existing ideas from their other car they made and some stuff transferred from the caterham +4 chassis.

It took us ~9months to do the first chassis, we had designed the bodywork and had various scale models / renderings of it but they refused to tool for any of it until they had 10 orders for cars

Yep, it is immensely time-consuming. The bodyshell my friend made from scratch is this:

Despite being slab-sided and without any significant compound curves it still took fer fecking ever.

Edit: Image won't embed on Chrome as it's not https. Here's a link for Chrome users.

Have a look for the Bitchin Rides programme. They are doing an old Corvette - not straight sided!

And, on the general question, it’s almost a complete build - new chassis etc. I suppose if they recreate the body work in carbon fibre it actually is a full build.

BTW your car looks fantastic - albeit a bit chilly today for it!!

See if you can get a copy of the Bosch automotive handbook, think it is version 10.

Suspension wise, I'd chat to either GAZ suspension in Essex or LEDA/HBE engineering norfolk.

Why not look up formula student, some teams build their own chasis, well design and get someone else to assemble the chassis. Design the suspension etc.

If you were in England, say go to Jevington house, near beachy Head to see and speak to the guys rebuilding, restoring the Campbell cars as well as building other vehicles.