Cycling Fitness / Training Advice

Does anyone have access to lactate threshold testing apparatus? I keep hearing / reading about burning muscles full of lactate after very intense efforts (HCs in my case) but I really don’t think I’ve ever experienced it. Maybe I just experience it differently. I’d like a boffin to tell me what’s going on. Wouldn’t mind knowing my vO2 max as well.

I looked into getting this done recently but the usual places are not doing it (Covid). May stump up for the kit myself in January.

I got my VO2 done gratis as part of a uni study. If we weren’t in a pandemic, you could ring round sport science departments and see if they need volunteers.

It was a horrible ramp test - +35w every three mins until failure. Would not ever wish to repeat it but think I did five min and 10 min power PRs.

Yeah I've seen a couple of ads on here for volunteers in similar studies, test included. I guess none of that is going on just now though.

There's a kit!?

Was reading this

1 Attachment

• Lactate+Handbook.pdf

Interesting. £350+ though. Cadence will do one for £100, but I suppose if the value you get is useful for training (I'm just curious / one off) it would make sense to get the analyser machine and test at home more regularly.

Incidentally, does anyone on here get a burning muscle sensation as I've heard described?

Yes, similar feeling to how your abs might feel doing 10 more sit-ups than your previous max.

How do your legs feel just before they stop working? Just tired?

Yeah, just run out of power, at the end of a ramp test I just can’t turn the pedals anymore but no burning sensation. My lungs are going mad like the end of a well paced HC, huge gasps of air, but no burn. Maybe I’m limited by CV system rather than lactate.

I would only see benefit of doing 3 or 4 tests as you move through base and into race season, which a few places do for £300. So at that rate you might as well get the setup yourself for £350.

Was thinking I'd recoup some of the cost by testing mates as well.

I'd help recoup that cost for you. I'd want to test in the next two weeks though, then probably not again until October 2021.

Proper gas exchange measuring system is much more than £350 isn't it?

Yes, you're taking blood lactic acid readings from your ear. So you're able to work out power at lactic acid values, won't give you a vo2 max

I'm sure it's more than £350 - that's not what I'm talking about though, I am after LT1 and LT2.

And not too fussed about v02 tbh, WKO5 already estimates mine very generously ;)

Ah, probably no help to you sorry.

Am settling for 50% of estimated v02 max for base work, and not worrying about it being too accurate, then taking it a bit more seriously/being a bit smarter from January onwards.

Yes - my muscles burn when I’m going hard. I’ve never really worked out if I fade because that becomes intolerable or whether my muscles are unable to draw enough oxygenated blood.

This book delves into some of the science and psychology of it. I found it a bit boring.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Bad-You-Want-Psychology/dp/1781315272

How do your legs feel at the end of say, a 1-1.5 minute 200% FTP effort (maybe 550-600w)?

In my case, my lungs are on fire, my legs feel like they are wooden logs that are on fire, and further pedalling feels like I am trying to pedal through leg cramps.
If I get off the bike, I have to hobble around, until the aching dies down.
Perhaps I am CV system limited for example I know that at the moment, my leg endurance/repeatability/HR recovery is rubbish, though I can put out ok power at anaerobic and vo2.

There’s no way I could do 60 to 90 seconds at 200% FTP! Time to retest?

I did 2:11 at 162% FTP last Sunday. Legs felt fine, gasping for air but no burn.

Maybe its fast twitch vs slow twitch fibre composition?
My legs are a bit odd, short, very fast twitchy and I struggle with medium to long sweetspot/FTP intervals due to leg pain rather than CV. My legs feel better climbing out the saddle at slower cadence (maybe slower lactate generation), recently did Ventoux on Zwift completely out the saddle at 50-60rpm.

Fast twitch afaik generates much more waste products, so if your legs are very aerobically efficient, your legs might just run out of oxygen rather than boiling in lactate.

Can you do a 3m max effort, and then settle into sweetspot and keep going as your HR recovers? (other than any pursuiter's coughing fits etc). If I do, I genuinely can't move my legs properly for at least 5 minutes.

Sounds like I’m the opposite to you. I rarely get out the saddle on long (30-60 mins) climbs. I can do sweet spot all week and always around 100 rpm. I’m not good at really short HCs, preferring around 4 mins. I really like the even longer ones, there are a few 10+ mins in Wales that were great last year.

Not sure about the 3 min max then sweet spot but I guess so. I don't think I’ve done an interval in that format but I’m sure I’ve overcooked the start of a Col then had to settle down for the next 25 mins.

Thanks doctor Acliff, no lactate test needed, I just have aerobic legs. Lactate sounds gross, glad I don’t have to deal with it! Also glad I don’t have to compete against Callum Brown on 1:30 climbs.

National HC is probably 2:45 for me this year so I’m not expecting much.

I don't think for shorter durations % of FTP are that useful, maybe more as a description of how good your anerobic power is compared to your FTP?

My last year PB was 550w for 90s at an FTP of 250w, (220% FTP) weight of 65kg. (8.46w/kg)
My FTP is about 290w now, but a bit heavier and legs feel a bit less punchy.

My gut tells me that I should be able to push 550-600 for 120s, if I get into super focused training, but life has got in the way a bit this year!

Lactate sounds gross, glad I don’t have to deal with it!

My mind is boggling at the idea that you don't. Even the term "threshold" is derived from/related to lactate threshold isn't it?

My 90 second power for this year is 492w, FTP 290w, 61kg - so 170%. Body types eh!