• The erasing history was frustrating. I tried to give current examples of actually erasing history - eg the repetition of the statement that Britain was the first country to abolish slavery.

    Part of the challenge is I think that these arguments come from an emotional place of a feeling of loss and attack. Being attacked triggers a base response which is hard to defused. Is the best way to counteract that to explain that there is no loss? The problem there is that once the primeval part of your brain is engaged you need an emotional angle - ideally another fear or danger. The status quo self evidently can't provide that.

    (thinking aloud here).

    @Dramatic_Hammer - I reckon Saville is the one to use. Hilter comes across as too extreme on the balance sheet of history.

  • Don’t think even for a second that the abolition of slavery had anything to do with humanity.. in fact it wasn’t even an overnight transition on Britain’s part, the word gradual comes to mind.

    Look at our colonial history, America’s independence, the industrial revolution, the machine age.

    Slaves just became obsolete, it’s not what we were taunt in school in the 80s, might be different today. William Wilberforce credited for the change through Parliament, but not at the expense of those in power.

    #fightthepower

  • abolition of slavery... taunt in school

    This is one of the frustrations about people referencing erasing history. The lobby for abolition had many elements, including for e.g. the wealth advantage Haiti brought France in a world (as you note) where Britain was benefiting from industrialization. The Black Jacobins by C. L. R. James is great for discussing points like these and the strategic reasons for pushing abolition. While I believe topics such as the Haitian revolution should be taught, I get why teaching history in school is focused on the host country and it's role - it's natural. What isn't, is erasing all the wider factors which directly involve the host country.

    @branwen

    I genuinely don't think that racism needs a negative discrimination;

    FYI that's an opinion that now runs counter to the norm in academia and among the main thought leaders on the subject.

    Also just to explain why I'm so preoccupied with the message and discussion, in case anyone thinks I'm trying to downplay or justify anything, it's probably also worth stating one of my biases: - I've been heavily influenced working next to a salesperson and his team who's bible was Pitch Anything coupled with later discussing the Fisherprice science contained within with a Dr working in psychiatry.

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