The Vegan Thread

Big up Jermain Defoe - one of the most likeable footballers already, and crediting his veganism for his recent revival:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/mar/27/jermain-defoe-england-striker-lithuania

Not the first, but like you said, one of the most likeable!

He can't kick the leather football! Doh

Don't play football so never thought about it but are they still leather? I would have thought they'd invented some much better composite or something by now. You know so they can charge more.

Still this is big news for veganism. Its in the mainstream now! Not there was any doubt?

I believe footballs are pretty much all synthetic these days

Just looked a bit, official balls of premier league (nike) are synthetic leather.

His boots might well be kangaroo leather though.

I've just read the guardian article linked above and it's piqued my curiosity.

Who here trains 8 plus hours a week on a vegan diet? I'm keen to ask some questions.

I do. between 10 - 20 hours per week, mostly off-road, very hilly, whatever the weather. It's all become a LOT easier since I stopped eating death.

A few things to note. I eat almost no junk food, I avoid sugar as much as possible, and use fruits/dates instead. We had been eating a fair amount of oil (olive/coconut) but are going to cut that out too. Basically whole foods, fresh as possible, raw preferably.

I often do 100+ mile rides, and since being plant-based I have had almost no bonks, that may be attributable to having cut out sugar too, and on rides I carry things like avocados, fruits, nuts, nakd bars (mashed dates/nuts) rather than all that mass market energy food crap or free haribo from wiggle (both contain dead animals).

This might be worth a watch https://www.youtube.com/watchv=nnIQaYgV3bg

I would be in the 10-20 hr bracket if I wasn't constantly injured*. Have done a bunch of ultras and quintuple ironman on vegan diet. Unlike gabes, fucking love junk food tho.

*injuries all knock-ons from a smashed knee many years ago, not due to veganism leaving you weak, pitiful and kittenish.

Oh, I LOVE junk food. I just don't allow myself to eat it (much).

I have a bad knee from pre-vegan injuries too.

Another thing to add is recovery times. Top of climb recovery is noticeably faster, and post long multi-day ride recovery is also faster, and fatigue less extreme. It's a win win, plus, I wont get butt cancer (hopefully). My resting heart rate was always low, around 45bpm, it's now more like 40!

Thank you both.

I'm in the very early stages of research, so excuse basic questions. Also, I'm going to declare now that my reasons for this are purely for performance gain.

The only issues I can foresee if I chose to try a vegan diet is that I really like dairy. Meat and fish I can live without. But milk in coffee and cheese on pizza I will struggle with. Firstly, hand on heart, are the vegan alternatives good? Or a poor substitute and I should just get over it? Secondly, one of the main benefits that has attracted me to this is the possibility of increased energy and reduced recovery times. If I were to peruse a mostly vegan diet (i.e. occasional consumption of non vegan food) would I likely forgo those benefits? Or only temporarily? Basically, can I have my cake and (occasionally) eat it?

Last, my job is a pain in the ass and requires periods of late hours and therefore take out dinners. What is good in soho area for vegan lunches and take out? I used to use Beetroot on Berwick St all the time, but alas it's gone now. Anything I've spotted recently charges a small fortune for a few grains of quinoa.

Thanks for any advice.

Dairy was my vice too, and it is pretty much the worst of all the animal products for your health. We didn't eat much meat, and zero fish before we switched, but once we did, I dropped ~4Kgs in a couple of months without any other changes.

Vegan cheese is a) shit b) expensive c) shit and expensive. Don't bother with it. It's also loaded with terrible fats that aren't much better than dairy except the lack of casein protein. I know there are supposed to be some great artisanal cashew cheeses, but they are super expensive.

Vegan weiners are pretty great, have some not so great ingredients, but aren't too bad. I eat them quite often.

If it's purely for performance gain, maybe see what Greg May (from singletrack mag, and raced Tour Divide last year) has written about it http://www.gregorymay.ie/?tag=vegan

He's plant based purely for performance.

https://www.facebook.com/UNILADSound/videos/428506530826328/

Cheese has been my problem as well.... best reasonably priced and easily available alternative is the Sainsburys stuff I reckon....

Dairy was also a big deal for me, but not a problem to give up due to the ethics - pizza tastes great, but is based on death and cruelty, so you don't touch it. Understand that this is different for you, so it may be less easy.

Vegan cheese is rubbish, but getting 50% less rubbish every year. Violife is the best of the current options, makes a good ham and cheese sandwich or toastie (Tofurkey ham) but you won't get a proper tasting pizza (maybe another 5 years and we'll get there).

There are all kinds of milk alternatives, but I don't drink tea or coffee so couldn't tell you what difference they make. OH prefers soya milk in her coffee to cow's milk, fwiw.

Don't really know Soho too well, but there are decent vegan lunch options in Pret, Pure, Crush, Wasabi, which I'm sure are local. Coach and Horses is veggie, and does a good tofush and chips, Mildreds is local, and there are pretty decent Asian options iirc.

I think it comes down to how willing you are to re educate yourself on how to eat. If you expect to have things like meat or cheese, then you're going to have to compromise and eat these substitutes that aren't as good. Or you're willing to start over without expectations, and just eat fruit, veg, legumes and nuts/seeds. It's simple, more nutritious, and gives you way better energy levels.

I tried vegan cheese, and some other things a far bit after the switch, but quickly gave up on them, as they weren't worth it (except tofu weiners).

Not sure about coffee but I made the switch to soya milk in tea. I also switched to decaffeinated too - which is also a bit different. It tastes quite different to how it used to but I found that I got used to it really quickly and don't feel like i miss it at all.

It took a week I guess.

Timely article. The comments will probably be best avoided - even the Graun attracts about a billion 'yeah, but bacon lol' trolls to veganism articles:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/29/veganism-jermain-defoe-plant-diet

Hm I should try soya for tea but for coffee I've found black with a dash of cold water tastes better than any milk substitute.
I think comments above are interesting about re-calibrating expectations... Sounds a bit miserable to be honest but I'm sure tastes change with time, especially if flavours come loaded with emotion!

Yeah, sounds miserable, but you're right, your tastes change. I saw someone drinking a glass of milk yesterday. Gross!

Oat milk in coffee is the best. Don't like almond/soy milk in coffee at all.

Does oat milk curdle in coffee the way soy does if its cold?

Depends which oat milk. Oat Dream is the best, I think it has Xanthan Gum as an emulsifier so it doesn't curdle. The Oatly one isn't too bad, if you let it go cold it does a little. still better than soy.