No-Fork project, bicycle geometry hacked

One question, why not use the stem system you have, to determine the set-up. When you are happy with the adjustment, then use that as a template to fabricate a more substantial fork in steel?

Andy

Please elaborate... you seem to know more then I do

Now you get it.

When you think of a new idea, before forging on with it, think about why NOBODY has done it before and then go and do something else.

This is clueless bodging, not innovation or engineering.

I could see the point in an adjustable test fork type thing if you wanted to double check how something would handle before building a proper one. Don't think I'd make it like that though, adjustable stems are bad enough as stems.

The first bike was very interesting, and in no way looked bodged. The hubs themselves had a lot going on. I'd imagine testers genius to lunatic ratio was actually rather conservative, but it only takes one.

I really think @No_Fork should just say 'here's my work, make of it what you will'. The world needs people to try new things, but it's normally the world that gets to judge if and what use they will be, not the creator.

'here's my work, make of it what you will'

:) Thats all i was trying to say more or less. Love to have a discussion on the how and why, im seriously interested in what people think, but only if they are willing to spend a minute or two and think about it.
Clearly there is a number of people here who feel it necessary to judge quickly and have a problem adjusting to reality. Just think its stupid to have fixed mindset like that

I think part of the problem is that it was not too clear why you have posted it here. It seems to me that you have done some interesting thinking, done some interesting work and want to show it to people, which is great, and something that this forum has always had a lot of time for (papier mache helmet anyone?). However bringing the whole patent thing in has raised peoples hackles, as it implies that you either want to just sell stuff, or you are using the forum for free market research/ advertising, the sort of thing that pisses people off. As the thread has gone on, it's pretty clear (to me) that you are here for honest reasons, but the mood was set, and you maintained it. Also, it's important to never forget the foffa thread. Ever.

Couple of years ago I went to the European Handmade Bicycle Show with the blue bike. A lot of bike builders took a ride on it and were amazed at how it handled, no one expected it to behave like a normal bike... once riding it and being able to ride it no hands people convinced themselves agains their previous expectation.
The problem with the construction of the blue bike was that if i wanted to make another one the adjustments on the camber of the wheel needs to be very precise. That could be done for a couple, but it wasnt very satisfying to me.
About a year ago the adjustment problem came up again and I was able to devise an axle that has a mechanism in it that allows for a very precise adjustment of the camber.
the next day the axle was made... now i needed to make it stick to the bike. I never quite know how this works but suddenly i realized that a stem does exactly what I needed to make. Et Voila, 15 min later everything was put together. It took some more time to find a proper setting but it was infinitely much quicker then with the blue bike :)
this was on the Romany bike. I used a 1" tube from a regular fork for the part in the head-tube, and glued a 1 1/8" tube to it for the lower part. Yes glued! (I can hear you think...)
For simplicity's sake I felt it needed to be a single part, one 1 1/8" tube top to bottom. I had to get a special set of bearings to make that happen but Im very pleased with the result in an aesthetic kind of way.
This project is for me and for me only right now. No intentions yet of bringing it to market or anything, just enjoying thinking about it and making it.

Aha, I get what youre saying, never realized it that way. Thanks for clearing that up for me

To answer some of the other questions above, my initial idea was to just use a stem for testing and determining the set-up. But after a while I realized using the stem was actually a nice solution, and that it creates simple adjustment options. At first i started using two different stems to adjust trail according to my whereabouts. A slightly longer stem to shorten trail for city use, a shorter one for longer distances. Last thing i did was spend a little money on the adjustable stem, but it hasnt really worked well. The amount in which it adjusts trail is quite short as the angle through which it can move is limited and it requires a bigger arc to make a real difference. On the Romany bike Im back to using two different stems now

No, it's a clueless way to stand in this matter. On your part.

So 3 years ago you were using canted wheels, are you still? I don't see how the most recent version incorporates and angle in the wheel.

Also, this

and this

make it look like there are sub fag paper clearances in a couple different places (at the seatclamp and at the downtube).

Any vids of the newest version in use?

I don't see how the most recent version incorporates and angle in the wheel.

I think he mentioned a method of dialling in the camber with the axle mounting, I'm guessing some thing akin to the adjustable-angle Specialized stems

I thought Mike Burrows had been building bikes with offset rear wheels for a while now, proving they track fine. Is the front a different story?

Isn't that so instead of having short drive side spokes with cassette they can be the same length like on a track hub?

Is the front a different story?

Yes, because the bike becomes a bit horrid if the tyre contact patch doesn't follow in line astern of the projection of the steering axis

Yep! Still canted wheel. Only at the front now, the frames of both bikes are regular frames. The part of the axle that has the spokes has an angle to the part of the axle that is in the stem. There is a bush around the axle in the stem with the opposite angle. Rotating both in contrary direction adjusts the angle of the wheel...
As you can see in the pictures the stem and wheel are the same one. I switch it between the bikes. The stem allows for very fine adjustment so i can make the clearances exactly the way i want them to be. So to have a small as possible angle of the wheel I set it as close to the clamp as it allows for. The wheel itself has its spoke holes eccentric to the left (in the riding direction). As for the clearance on the downtube, that looks much smaller then it actually is... as the wheel sits kind of besides the downtube. So in both pictures the downtube clearance is the same, it just looks different because of the angle the picture was taken in..

The front is quite a different story... There are a lot of forces at play on the front wheel. The rolling resistance of the tyre contact patch on the ground exerts a force on the head-tube bearing. So it needs to be carefully alligned to keep it from going 'horrid'

Yesterday the second patent application was filed

This was March 2012. How's the patent process going?

Something like that yeah, only has a second one inside to counter the otherwise influenced track angle

I retracted the patent... realizing it needed more work and not sure if I ever want to bring it to market. Now that its much easier to adopt on regular bikes bringing it to market would be much easier, but i have other things to attend to..

Yep! Still canted wheel. Only at the front now, the frames of both bikes are regular frames. The part of the axle that has the spokes has an angle to the part of the axle that is in the stem. There is a bush around the axle in the stem with the opposite angle. Rotating both in contrary direction adjusts the angle of the wheel...

Cool.

Not sure I have much more than that to say about it.

I think if it makes you happy then fair play.

It's probably a very good advert for your machining and problem solving skills.

The question remains... Why?

What advantage are you claiming over a standard setup? Or even a "lefty"?

If you can name advantages... Do you think they outweigh the disadvantages?

I guess the best possible answer is "why not"?

....